98 replies to this topic

[goodeats]

Dear members - for once, I decided to start a new topic, because, frankly, I need advice on certain kitchen equipment purchases.

In this case, I want to buy a nice loaf pan, with a lid if possible, but have no idea what type to purchase, or which brand. Right now, I have a glass loaf pan, which is not working well with bread loaves. Ideally, I would like to buy something that bakes a hokkaido loaf, but don't know where to go or what brand to purchase.

However, even for regular grain toast bread, I don't know which loaf pan, brand, material or size to get.

Please help!

Thank you,
a very lost goodeats.

[Pat]

I've got a couple of loaf pans from King Arthur. They have a couple with lids.

[Anna Blume]

I prefer metal to glass for baking bread, but glass should work fine. Some experts will tell you to lower oven temperature 25 degrees when baking pies in a glass vs. metal plate, so.... No brands of metal in particular, though darker finishes are said to give you a darker crust, so you'll have more control with lighter metals, perhaps.

Surfaces of most loaf pans these days tend to be a little slick--coated w something that is supposed to make getting the loaves out of pan easier--this isn't usually a PITA, but it can invite steam to collect on surface if you're baking something that needs to rest before removal from pan. I always take yeast breads out of the pan during final stage of baking to improve crust anyway, so.... Whatever you do, do not buy silicon.

Regarding thread: I could see the topic being narrowed in scope and/or linked to technique in an established thread. Perhaps, leleboo, we do need a Baking 911 topic.

PS. Why lid? You can get ones specifically for making pain de mie.

[zoramargolis]

America's Test Kitchen had a recent "equipment corner" episode on bread baking pans. Their verdict was that the copper-colored metal loaf pan from Williams Sonoma did the best job, in terms of a perfect crust. Light-colored pans tend to under-brown the portion of the crust that is inside the pan, and dark-metal ones did a better job, but need to be watched carefully, lest the crust get too dark.

[grover]

I would like to add more to Zora's answer. America's Test Kitchen tested with 7 loaf pans in Jan. 2007 as follows:
1. All-Clad Gold Standard Non-stick Loaf Pan ($74.95)
2. Anolon Suregrip Non-stick Loaf Pan ($16.95)
3. Baker’s Secret Basics Non-Stick Large Loaf Pan ($6)
4. Doughmakers Loaf Pan ($14.95)
5. KitchenAid’s Professional Non-stick Loaf Pan ($19.95)
6. Pyrex Glass Loaf Pan ($4.99)
7. Williams-Sonoma Goldtouch Non-stick Loaf Pan ($19)

I am copying their result here:
Bigger pans like 2 and 5 allowed the sandwich bread to bake up a bit fluffier than did smaller pans but yielded dense, square pound cakes. Narrower pans (except 2 and 5) were the only correct choice for pound cake and fine for sandwich bread.

Our other primary concern was browning. Light-colored aluminum finishes (1 and 4) yielded pale, anemic-looking baked goods. On the other hand, the dark nonstick surface on our previous winner (3) actually browned the bread and pound cake a shade too much. Despite its wide availability and low price, it's no longer our top choice. Glass Pyrex browned nicely, but the real star of the show (7) had a gold-colored nonstick surface that yielded baked goods with a perfectly even, honeyed-copper crust.

7 years before the above testing date, they applauded the Baker's Secret Non-stick Loaf Pan but not any more.

[TheMatt]

$75?! For a loaf pan?!

[goodeats]

PS. Why lid? You can get ones specifically for making pain de mie.

Yep - pain de mie, but I just call it Asian bread - I like the symmetry. :-)

ETA: Ultimate goal.

[Anna Blume]

Yep - pain de mie, but I just call it Asian bread - I like the symmetry. :-)

Ahhhh, then if you're not into Amazon.com like the blog's author, then go to a huge, schmanzy-pants kitchen store in NYC or Paris. I'm guessing Sur la Table, here, too. Just ask for p-d-m pans vs. a particular brand hereabouts.

[The Hersch]

I have a Chicago Metallic lidded pullman pan, which is an excellent piece of equipment. Unfortunately, I don't remember where I got it, but it looks like Sur la Table carries it (I'm sure I didn't buy it from them).

[lperry]

Has anyone tried the new titanium nonstick surface skillets? My old teflon (or whatever it is) is no longer nonstick, and I'm looking for something new and, hopefully, improved. If the titanium works well and lasts, I may consider spending more on the pan.

[monavano]

Has anyone tried the new titanium nonstick surface skillets? My old teflon (or whatever it is) is no longer nonstick, and I'm looking for something new and, hopefully, improved. If the titanium works well and lasts, I may consider spending more on the pan.

I'm very happy with my Calphalon non-stick omelette pans - 10 and 12 inch pans that came as a set. $50 at Macy's. Now $46 and change on Amazon.

[lperry]

I'm very happy with my Calphalon non-stick omelette pans - 10 and 12 inch pans that came as a set. $50 at Macy's. Now $46 and change on Amazon.

Have you had them long enough to know the coating will last? Most nonstick pans last me about a year, then they turn into stick and burn pans.

[monavano]

Have you had them long enough to know the coating will last? Most nonstick pans last me about a year, then they turn into stick and burn pans.

I've had them for about 3 months. I'm treating them like cast iron with very little cleaning - trying to avoid dish soap. I just rinse and wipe. so far, omlettes are folding and rolling out like a dream. I do hope it lasts.

[Banco]

Have you had them long enough to know the coating will last? Most nonstick pans last me about a year, then they turn into stick and burn pans.

I have a griddle from that same series. The non-stick surface began to fail after a year or two despite careful use of plastic or wood utensils. I think generally non-stick items have an extremely low life span and you're better off going cheap and replacing often.

For omelets, though, I'd avoid non-stick altogether and use a classic steel pan specifically for the purpose.

[lperry]

... I think generally non-stick items have an extremely low life span and you're better off going cheap and replacing often.

I've been using this strategy, and hate to treat something like a pan as disposable. Hope springs eternal for a lasting non-stick pan.

[Banco]

I've been using this strategy, and hate to treat something like a pan as disposable. Hope springs eternal for a lasting non-stick pan.

Agreed. But I do have an All-Clad NS omelet pan that has served me well (under light use) for several years. Pricey though.

[lperry]

I just ordered these. The wording of the guarantee is iffy, but it's worth a shot.

[goodeats]

I just ordered these.

I don't know about that specific pan, but I heart my Circulon pan. It has been great and it's coming up on a year, so can't tell is the nonstick is still doing its thing....

[Barbara]

I, for one, am fed up with non-stick cookware. This business of throwing out pans after a couple of years just sucks. I am on the hunt for replacements to the stuff we have been using all the time. It's fascinating to read the Amazon reviews of enamelled cast iron--particularly the Martha Stewart brand. Seems that the interior enamel chips off and gets in your food. , unless you open your wallet for Le Creuset. I'm glad I read those reviews before partaking of a particularly excellent sale price on a smaller dutch oven. So, I went to BB&Beyond and found the perfect pan to replace my 4-qt Circulon pot that is losing its nonstick surface. Only problem? It's only sold in the sets. I even emailed Calphalon and was directed to their many outlet stores. So, a much cheaper stainless steel KitchenAid 3.5 qt pan from Overstock is enroute. It was cheap enough that I won't be horribly disappointed if it doesn't quite fit the bill. If it does, it will go in a yard sale and I will shell out for the Analon stainless steel pan which is almost an exact match for the Circulon and will fit in its spot;

There is absolutely no space in my tiny kitchen for superfluous stuff. I remembered that my mother had a horribly warped saute pan with a lid that she used all the time to cook meals for a family of five--this is before Teflon even existed. I (and Dame Edna) only need to cook for two most of the time and our range won't handle a 12" inch pan (unless there is no other in use). Why this should be so difficult, I just don't know.

[KMango]

Have not tried the titanium, but have gotten over three years of several-times-a-week use with this one. It still looks and performs as good as day one:

http://www.amazon.co...ref=oss_product

Important tips for nonstick longevity include avoiding high heat. Don't heat an empty pan, use nonstick spray as protectant. Unless it's low heat with gentle cleansers, consider your dishwasher The Enemy of Coatings. If it's been a long day and you need to blow off dishes until the morning, quickly wipe down and/or put water in the nonstick cookware to further extend life.

Not sure if you are also considering the original nonstick cookware---a well-seasoned cast iron skillet. Doubles as a slapstick comedy prop, always a plus.

[monavano]

Have not tried the titanium, but have gotten over three years of several-times-a-week use with this one. It still looks and performs as good as day one:

http://www.amazon.co...ref=oss_product

Important tips for nonstick longevity include avoiding high heat. Don't heat an empty pan, use nonstick spray as protectant. Unless it's low heat with gentle cleansers, consider your dishwasher The Enemy of Coatings. If it's been a long day and you need to blow off dishes until the morning, quickly wipe down and/or put water in the nonstick cookware to further extend life.

Not sure if you are also considering the original nonstick cookware---a well-seasoned cast iron skillet. Doubles as a slapstick comedy prop, always a plus.

This pan is my workhorse, go-to vessel for so many dishes - especially one pot(s). Mine is 9-10 years old and still performs well. I saute and braise in it, and wouldn't think of making chili in anything else. Mine is the Calphalon 6-quart braiser, and actually has a metal lid, which I guess it was outfitted with at the time.

[lperry]

Important tips for nonstick longevity include avoiding high heat. Don't heat an empty pan, use nonstick spray as protectant. Unless it's low heat with gentle cleansers, consider your dishwasher The Enemy of Coatings. If it's been a long day and you need to blow off dishes until the morning, quickly wipe down and/or put water in the nonstick cookware to further extend life.

I am pretty good about following the nonstick rules, but the coated pans still wear out. Maybe the ones with the materials embedded in the pot metal are better? What's really interesting to me is that the new nonsticks claim you can use them to sear.

Not sure if you are also considering the original nonstick cookware---a well-seasoned cast iron skillet. Doubles as a slapstick comedy prop, always a plus.

I love my cast iron skillets, but I still use the nonstick for eggs, crepes, risotto cakes... I just like being able to use a lot less oil and butter if I want to.

[monavano]

I am pretty good about following the nonstick rules, but the coated pans still wear out. Maybe the ones with the materials embedded in the pot metal are better? What's really interesting to me is that the new nonsticks claim you can use them to sear.


I love my cast iron skillets, but I still use the nonstick for eggs, crepes, risotto cakes... I just like being able to use a lot less oil and butter if I want to.

My Calphalons are the slide non-stick, and they also have the sear non-stick.
Chef Michael Symon spokesperson demo here.

[lperry]

The Circulon pans came today, so I will report back on non-stickyness in the future. In the meantime, I thought some of the recommendations were interesting. There are three specific instructions.

1. "Use low to medium heat only. Excessive use of high heat will cause pan warping and permanent nonstick coating damage. Use of high heat and resulting nonstick damage is not covered under your warranty."

2. "Do not use nonstick cooking sprays on nonstick cookware - an invisible buildup will impair the nonstick release system and food will stick in your pan."

3. "Oil is not needed on nonstick cookware, but if you prefer oil for flavor, olive oil or peanut oil is recommended. Heavy vegetable oils may leave a residue that can affect nonstick performance. Use low heat when heating up oils. Oils can quickly overheat and cause a fire."

The high heat one is pretty standard, but no Pam? No vegetable oil? Who knew?

[Sthitch]

The high heat one is pretty standard, but no Pam? No vegetable oil? Who knew?

Every non-stick I have seen claims this, but I call bunk, true you do not need oil to prevent sticking, but the dry cooking is crap, the oil allows for far superior heat transfer from the pan to the food, and will give a more even browning - that all said you need far less oil in a non-stick, but I have yet to find one that actually cooks well with none.

I have never had to throw away an All-Clad non-stick, they can generally be found for a decent price at the William-Sonoma outlet in Leesburg.

[Ilaine]

Electric slicer, the kind they have in delis? Anybody have one? Recommendations?

[goodeats]

I don't have one, but my brother-in-law likes his. They purchased theirs at Costco but I don't know which brand.

I have seen ones on sale online by Kalorik at around $60 or $70 that look nice.

[lperry]

A question for the materials engineers out there: Is there any difference in the types of glass used for regular drinking glasses and those designed for hot beverages like tea and Irish coffee? I'm going to guess that the tempering is similar, but I'd like some back-up before I shatter a glass.

[zoramargolis]

A question for the materials engineers out there: Is there any difference in the types of glass used for regular drinking glasses and those designed for hot beverages like tea and Irish coffee? I'm going to guess that the tempering is similar, but I'd like some back-up before I shatter a glass.

Regardless, put a spoon in the glass before pouring in the hot liquid.

[lperry]

My kitchen scale is off by about 15%. Cooks Illustrated likes the Oxo - does anyone else have one they really like?

[goodeats]

I really like mine, except for the fact it takes those mini-CR battery. Of course, I can't find the name, but it's the $23 one at Target, grey, with a round disc as the weighing part. It measures in ounces and grams, so it's perfect for my baking needs.

I also really like the Leifheit brand (I'm not sure I spelled that right).

Will update when I get home.

I don't recommend a Salton, but I had a really basic model and it broke down after a month of use. Nicer models might be different. This current one has lasted two years so far.

[Anna Blume]

I don't recommend a Salton, but I had a really basic model and it broke down after a month of use. Nicer models might be different. This current one has lasted two years so far.

I really like a slim, glass Salter that resembles a miniature bathroom scale. It was recommended by a knowledgeable guy at Sur la Table where it ran about $50 (more than six years ago); ended up finding the same model for less at Linen & Things.

[TheMatt]

I've been eyeing the My Weigh KD8000 which has baker's percentages. But, I've never known anyone with a My Weigh, so I'm not sure of their quality. Might bite the bullet soon...

[lperry]

I'm still trying to decide, and I'm afraid I'm being influenced by aesthetics. Pretty. It also gets some good reviews, though.

[DC Deb]

I have used a postal scale bought at Staples for years. It's not pretty but it's reliable. http://www.amazon.co..._pr_product_top

[Barbara]

We have a Cuisinart WeighMate that Dame Edna got for free (for buying something or other). I doesn't look exactly like what you find under that name these days, but I just love it. Even if it didn't cost anything. There is a tare function and you can choose metric or US weights. Can't beat that.

[porcupine]

I just got an Escali (the one in the King Arthur Flour catalog), and it's been getting quite a workout. I like it for its simplicity: two buttons (on/off/tare and g/oz). It weighs to 0.05oz/1g, and the latter button, pushed a third time, goes to pounds:oz readout. I think the upper limit is 11lbs. Also 4 minute auto shutoff.

[lperry]

My excellent new scale indicates that my defunct scale weighs 564 grams. Just out of the box, but accurate within a gram or so with known weights, and it looks really nice.



Edited to add that the little hold button gets pushed before you weigh something larger than the scale. You remove the large item, and it holds the number on the screen for five additional seconds so you can see how much it weighed.

[ktmoomau]

Cookware I have:
Cuisinart set of sauce pans and lidded sauce pan/skillet thing that is bigger and fairly deep that I use a lot.
Huge, extremely heavy non-stick skillet that I use for big things.
Calaphon Wok.
Calaphon hard anodized 8" skillet.
Two le crueset enamel cast iron dutch ovens of different sizes
Cast Iron skillet, that I would use more if my husband would listen to me and not put it in the dishwasher afte I finally get it seasoned.
Grill pan that I will probably need to replace soon.

What I need is two smaller replacement non-sticks for things like eggs, sautee of veggies, etc. Probably a 10 and 12. The caveat being that my husband, bless his heart, is going to use these things hard. He is going to put them in the dishwasher, he is going to put them on high heat (he doesn't understand that there is any other type of heat really), he may or may not use cooking spray. And I can try to lecture him on this type of thing, but I am not going to win, so honestly it isn't worth it. Given this, I am thinking the dual set of calaphon non-stick skillets at $50 is probably a good idea? I don't want something really heavy, but I want something that works well. I would spend more money on something that would potentially last longer or work better, maybe all-clad, but with my Hubby's habits I don't know that anything will last all that long. Thoughts? And there are so many types of non-stick any preference between the contemporary v. unison v. unison slide with calaphon or other series? Cutleryandmore.com is having a sale right now and there are some decent options and I can always get free shipping from there.

Also any preference on an offset v. normal bread knife? I have one of these and just don't really like it all, perhaps I am using it wrong?

[bettyjoan]

Given this, I am thinking the dual set of calaphon non-stick skillets at $50 is probably a good idea?

I have that dual set, and I love it for exactly what you are talking about - eggs, quick saute, some fish, etc etc. I don't put it in the dishwasher, so I'm not sure how long it would last under the circumstances you mentioned, but I've been really pleased with the durability and utility.

Of course, your other option is to quit cooking for your husband until he learns how to play nice with your toys.

[TheMatt]

Also any preference on an offset v. normal bread knife? I have one of these and just don't really like it all, perhaps I am using it wrong?

Only my opinion, but for me, offset all the way. It's so nice not to have my knuckles rapping on the cutting board (or going diagonally into the bread) with every slice.

[Ilaine]

Reasonably priced non stick pans that can take a lot of abuse can be found at Quality Restaurant Supply, a very well equipped Chinese restaurant supply store in a little industrial area off Edsall Road. From 395 take Edwall Road East exit, right at the light onto Bren Mar (look for Panera Bread) right onto General Washington, left onto General Green, they're behind the Duron Paint store.
http://maps.google.c...652485193395228

If you are coming from 95 or 495, take 395 north and stay in the right lane, that's the Edsall Road East exit.

No food, just everything else you need to run a Chinese restaurant. The prices are amazing, like wholesale, but they sell to everybody. One quirky thing, the clerk will keep an eye on you as if she suspected you of shoplifting. Don't let it get to you, it's nothing personal.

You can buy any size of non stick skillet for fractions of brand name prices, but make sure you get an insulating handle thingie to slide over the handle for home use, those restaurant style handles get really hot.

[zoramargolis]

Spending a lot of money for non-stick pans is a waste, IMO. The non-stick coating only lasts a year or so with regular use, so while I use my All-Clad stainless pots and pans daily, I would never consider buying an All-Clad non-stick. I recently needed a new small pan, and hefted all the various ones they had at Macy's. The Cuisinart was nice and heavy and was the least expensive of the several that were in contention with sufficient heft. I've been happy with it.

[lperry]

Last year about this time I bought a pair of Circulon pans off their website. I'm not completely happy - they are poorly balanced - but the nonstick is still as nonstick as it was when I got them, and I use the small pan nearly every morning. Their coating got better ratings than most, so that could be the reason for the relative durability, but I also (for once) followed the directions, and I haven't used heat higher than medium-low. YMMV.

[bookluvingbabe]

I think husband's should be kept away from all expensive cookware. Mine has been known to take a small 1quart All-Clad saucepan and scramble eggs in it. He even used it to pan fry a salmon burger the other night.

I had given up on non-stick cookware because of the abuse he gives them. But we got a set of Le Cresuet as a gift right after we got married that stayed in the box until this year. The non-sticket skillet in that set (which can't be more than 9 inches) seems to be holding up well. It cooks like a dream. I have no idea how much it would be individually--the entire set we received was around $500 and that was in 2004. (We didn't open it for years because it is red and all my other Le Cresuet is green. I gave in when I was desperate for another skillet.)

[ktmoomau]

Of course, your other option is to quit cooking for your husband until he learns how to play nice with your toys.

Hahahahha, the problem is when I leave, when I am there I can normally sufficiently supervise. We almost got in a huge fight over laundry sorting and execution- I made him replace all the items he ruined in two loads of laundry and he quickly learned the error of his ways. Perhaps I should start this with cooking gadgets, or make him work on reseasoning a pan once he puts it in the dishwasher. I could just cook AND clean up, but that is not going to happen honestly. And he would still do dumb things when I left the premises.

[thistle]

I almost don't even want to touch this subject-my husband is doing the 'geo bachelor' thing', & I magnanimously volunteered all my cookware, & he took most of it, & I'm sure he doesn't use it-I am definitely going to buy another small saucepan. Another equipment question-Aldi has a small deep fryer on sale this week-I currently don't deep-fry a lot, use my wok for stuff to be fried. But I think it would be handy for a few things that are better deep-fried (the only thing I come up w/ is spring rolls)-should I resist my tendency to buy stuff, & pass on this, or is a deep fryer a useful piece of equipment?

[monavano]

If you have the room for a fryer, I say they're fun to have and I love that it's so easy. Just set the temp and drop the basket. That said, it's a bit redundant because of course you can just use a pot to heat oil.

[The Hersch]

The Chef's Catalog that appeared in my mailbox a couple of days ago has a new non-stick frying pan from Henckels that looks interesting. From the blurb:

The Thermolon stainless-steel nonstick skillet is engineered of natural non-organic materials. The patented Thermolon Granite nonstick surface is a breakthrough in nonstick ceramic cookware that uses 60% less carbon in manufacturing than traditional nonstick materials without adding environmental pollutants. Thermolon Granite nonstick is exceptionally durable and scratch- and abrasion-resistant for years of easy release cooking without using oil or butter.

With the tri-ply Sigma Clad construction of a polished magnetic stainless-steel exterior and strong aluminum core, the stainless-steel nonstick skillet conducts heat evenly from rim to rim for uniform cooking without hot spots. The energy-efficient Zwilling Thermolon nonstick fry pan is the ideal heat-retentive cookware for pan frying or sauteing ahi fish burgers, pork loin chops with apple cider sauce, crab rolls or chocolate banana crepes. Compatible with all cooktops including induction, the TruClad stainless-steel nonstick skillet features an ergonomic, riveted stainless-steel handle that stays cool to the touch. Hand washing is recommended.

They're not hugely expensive, merely rather expensive. Won't someone buy one, try it out, and report back so I don't have to risk my own money?

[thistle]

& my experience w/ nonstick, buy inexpensive, replace when needed-I can' t imagine not heating over med-low, how do you make quesadillas?