Venice and Tuscany (around Asciano)

[Rieux]

Dear all,

Leaving for 12 days in Italy tomorrow -- 4 in Rome, 4 in Tuscany, and 4 in Venice.

We are all set in Rome, as I have several Roman friends who have set us up with restaurants owned by their friends.

On the drive from Rome to Tuscany we will probably stop in Orvieto for lunch -- suggestions in Orvieto welcome!

In Tuscany we are staying near Asciano and will day trip to places like Siena, Chianti, etc. Last time I went, Dean Gold gave me great recommendations for places like Il Conte Matto in Trequanda, but I am wondering if there are new suggestions for good places to have a large nice lunch in Siena, the Chianti area, etc. For these 4 days we basically just want to drive to different towns/villages and wander, eat, and relax so we have no set itinerary. If there are specific wineries we should visit in the area, we are also open to these suggestions!

Finally, any Venice recommendations would be welcome!

This is a honeymoon trip, so we are happy to have a mix of less-expensive and more-expensive options.

[Joe H]

http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/605395

[deangold]

On the drive, do La SOlita Zuppa in Chiusi over Orvieto. Etruscan museum there too!

Near Asciano, every vilage has oneor two good restaurants. Between Asciano and Siena, near Murlo is Bosco alla Spina which we loved a long while back. Haven't been recently. North of Siena is our favorite biker bar / dive / hang out called Bar Orso. Tiny bar in front, then a sandwich and unceasingly a few hot dishes in the back. Music to at night. Fabulous Porchetta.

South of Montalcino in Sant'Angelo is Colle is Il Pozzo, home cooking at its best

Also, in Montepuliano is Il Gamba di Gatto which is a crazy wine bar with food. The owner makes me seem indifferent about food and wine. He was apologetic he only had 20 bottles of olive oil the mid winter day we were there!

[deangold]

Venice: Do Mori, La Cantinetta and Il Marca for wine bars. Vitus Venezia as well. La Frasca for great food, da Giglio as well. Fiaschetteria Toscana for food and wine immersion for a pretty penny but very worht it,

[Rieux]

Thanks so much! I think Dean should open an Italian travel/eating agency! Dino Italian Food tours... I see it....

[MMM]

Osteria Acquacheta di Giulio Ciolfi - Via del Teatro 2, Montepulciano (+39) 0578 717086 (tel & fax). Go here for incredible Bistecca alla Fiorentina. We went for lunch. The chef comes to your table, sizes you up and brings out the slab of steak he's proposing for you. Delicious beef, perfectly cooked. I would call ahead to book a table.

Several years ago we followed Dean's advice to try Bosco della Spina. Had a lovely lunch there too. Beautiful setting and delicious food.

[deangold]

Several years ago we followed Dean's advice to try Bosco della Spina. Had a lovely lunch there too. Beautiful setting and delicious food.

Good to know it was still fine a couple of years ago. The last couple of times we ahve been in Montalcino, we have not been able to get to Conte Matto or Bosco della Spina so our recs are based on food from 7+ years ago.

[Choirgirl21]

Will be watching this thread with interest as I am traveling to Italy in December, but have ZERO idea of what or where I will be except that I will be starting in Vincenza where my friend will be stationed.

[Joe H]

Will be watching this thread with interest as I am traveling to Italy in December, but have ZERO idea of what or where I will be except that I will be starting in Vincenza where my friend will be stationed.

I brokered for a company in Vincenza for years. In fact at one point in the '90's I was going to take over their North American sales. I've also sold rides to Gardaland just west of Verona. http://www.hotelroxyplaza.it/index.cfm?lang=en is outside the walls of Soave which is literally the home of the wine consortium of the Veneto. A thousand meters or so from the Autostrada, halfway between Vicenza and Verona. If you stay in the rear of the hotel the 1500+ year old forty foot high walls are a few yards from you. Venice is less than an hour east. Towns like Asolo and Bassano en Grappa are priceless and almost unknown by Americans.

Jen, this is one of the most beautiful and interesting places on earth. Please take a look at what I wrote for Chowhound three years ago: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/605395 I was told that this was one of their most popular posts ever on the Italy board with almost a half million hits. It will speak for itself along with the links referenced in it. Today Il Ridotto is in almost every guidebook for Venice. FWIW I was a "regular" on their Italian board with perhaps over a hundred or more trips to Italy over the years.

My wife and I spent ten or more Decembers in Venice and Verona. Because of heavy, seemingly endless travel I received free airline tickets every year which allowed my wife and I to go anywhere on earth. We chose where you are going.

Day trips would also include Cortina which is one of the most beautiful places in all of the Alps. The three Michelin star Le Calandre is in Rubano which is a western suburb of Padua, a half hour east of Vicenza. It is considered by some to be Italy's best restaurant http://www.alajmo.it/sezione.asp?pagina=calandre&lingua=ing. Three stars aside, for almost twenty years I ate my way around the countryside between Venice and Verona. There is also a major American base north of Vicenza which I am guessing that your friend is connected to.

Serious: take a long look at Verona, Soave, Asolo, Bassano en Grappa, Cortina even Trentino and Bolzano. If you remember nothing else from this post remember this: in Venice on many of the Vaporetto (water busses) you can sit outside, in front of the cabin. If it is warm enough. Riding these through the canals is one of the most magical experiences you will ever have. If you are not going to drive you can take a train perhaps basing yourself in Vicenza. East to Venice, west to Verona.

If you have not been in this area before and have a week or less I would focus on Venice (we've watched the "erection" of the Christmas tree in San Marco square; in Verona there is a restaurant that has their own "Christmas tree, 20 or so feet high, made out of wine bottles hanging from a wire frame in a courtyard) and Verona. If you are driving another world will open up to you which may include some of the towns I mentioned above. If you're not trains will become very important. I should also mention that Venice is MUCH more expensive than anywhere else. A botle of wine in an enoteca in Soave is two thirds of the same bottle in an enoteca in Venice.

[Choirgirl21]

Joe H, thanks so much. Right now everything you wrote is all Greek to me, but I will refer back and check out the thread on Chowhound when I dig a little deeper. I am hoping to go for about 2 weeks including travel time and there aren't really any restrictions on where I go other than finances. I'm not sure yet if my friend will have a car, but I would imagine we would take trains to areas farther away. Obviously we will use his place as a home base for the time we are in that area, but I would definitely like to see Venice, even if its only for a day and I would really like to get to Tuscany. I might also consider something coastal further south, or a quick stop in France on my way home. Depends on how flights work out - I am using miles to fly to/from.

[Joe H]

Jen, have you been in Italy before? Also, are you comfortable renting a car and risking getting unmercifully lost yourself? Believing that no matter how far out of the way you find yourself, you'll still get back to where you started?

[johnb]

Jen, have you been in Italy before? Also, are you comfortable renting a car and risking getting unmercifully lost yourself? Believing that no matter how far out of the way you find yourself, you'll still get back to where you started?

Having gotten lost while driving in Italy many times myself, I highly recommend it. One of the greatest joys of motoring aimlessly around Italy is the serendipity, although I'll admit this may be somewhat mitigated by the chill of December, at least in the North. I did this with maps, way before smartphones, and was always able to extricate myself eventually. I suspect that with map apps the process won't be so daunting.

[Choirgirl21]

Jen, have you been in Italy before? Also, are you comfortable renting a car and risking getting unmercifully lost yourself? Believing that no matter how far out of the way you find yourself, you'll still get back to where you started?

No. Yes. Yes. Remember, I will have a friend with me who will have been there for 7-8 months and will have the lay of the land. He's also a U.S. Army Ranger so I put good faith in his navigation skills. And I'm with Johnb that otherwise, it will be an adventure.

[deangold]

Things I learned driving in Italy:

Don't drive into any swimming pools being built.

Don't be surprised when you come to an intersection where all three choices available to you are one way heading to the intersection only.

It is very easy to burn out a clutch trying to back up slick cobble stones in Montalcino. I was backing up because I coudn't see the road over the hood of my VW Golf.

If you are trying to make a U turn in the centro of a tiny town in Tuscany and almost drive your car into a construction pit in the road, taking the rear view mirror of you car off while hitting the scaffolding of the construction project, a crowd will gather.

With the comprehensive insurance coverage you can take on car rentals in Italy, you can hand in your keys and just the rear view mirror and they will say "Grazie, Arriverdici!"

The same VW Golf that had the clutch adventure also drove just fine after the wheel well cover fell off. I mean what did hitting the wall of the 15th century castle have to do with anything?

Never rent a car that I have rented in Italy before.

And last of all, NEVER PUT BENZINE IN A DIESEL! GAZOLIO!

[Choirgirl21]

The lesson I just learned. Never get in a car that Dean is driving!

[Joe H]

No. Yes. Yes. Remember, I will have a friend with me who will have been there for 7-8 months and will have the lay of the land. He's also a U.S. Army Ranger so I put good faith in his navigation skills. And I'm with Johnb that otherwise, it will be an adventure.

1. You must go to Venice.

2. You must get lost somewhere in the mountains, i.e. heading for Cortina from Vicenza. Snow could impact a trip like this.

3. You must get lost somewhere near one of the lakes, i.e. Lake Garda, near Bellagio, etc. Snow could impact a trip like this.

4. If weather is bad use trains.

5. Rent the cheapest, smallest car you can.

6. You will get lost in Venice. Hope for fog. December is the best month to visit, weekdays the best of all. The foggier, the drearier, the more romantic. If you are lucky you won't be able to see more than 40 or 50 feet in front of you. Venice also has among the most expensive hotels in the world but I am one who believes you should spend at least one night there (especially if its foggy). December you should be able to find a good room for E 200 (which might be triple this in the summer). Location also matters. The Westin Europa y Regina is E 190 a night for a weeknight in the middle of December. Great location on the main canal, two or so walking blocks to San Marco. If you really want to blow it consider the Danieli which is low E 300's in December-E900 in the summer.