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Carluccio's - a UK-Based Italian Chain at 100 King Street in Old Town, and the Pike & Rose Development in Rockville - Closed


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I was walking around at lunch today and passed by 100 King St (vacant for awhile) and notice a bunch of permits on the windows and obvious demolition going on.  Went back to the office and did a bit of digging and found a submission by Carluccios on the upcoming docket of the Board of Architectural Reviews.  Apparently a UK based Italian chain.

Carluccios.pdf

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Huh, Italian in the location of death... well it might have to be a chain to be able to afford that rent.  But it's a little sad to keep seeing more and more chains on King St.  Luckily there are so many wonderful little side streets, but I know they don't get the same foot traffic, especially tourist foot traffic.

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Apr 27, 2014 "100 King Street Leased - Will Carluccio's Succeed Where Others Have Failed?" on redbricktown.com

May 5, 2014 "Carluccio's, European Restaurant-Market Concept, Coming To Old Town" by Rebecca Cooper on m.bizjournals.com

May 28, 2014 "Alexandria Is Just The First Stop For Carluccio's In DC Region" by Rebecca Cooper on m.bizjournals.com

Jun 14, 1024: "Carluccio's - Approvals and Demo Work Continues At 100 King" on redbricktown.com

carlucciosusa.com website

I have a very, very uneasy feeling about the long-term success of this project. Call it Tagliatellitis, or Wagamalgia, or King's Syndrome, but it's just a gut feel based on experience. *Someone* needs to be here - how are all these other places surviving? Long-term leases, I assume? I mean, there are lousy ice-cream parlors a block away from there that can't possibly be making any money. How can it be to the landlord's advantage to have vacant properties sitting there unless they have so much money that they just don't care.

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I wish it was a Wagamama!  I would go like once a week, but then I would also need to start working out more again. I actually saw one of these in the Marina Mall in Dubai.  It will be interesting to have a pizza place, across from a pizza place, by another pizza place.  But they have other stuff too, I know.  It will be interesting to see how they do. I would imagine the partners at my law firm will probably go from time to time just to switch it up, and our picky eating partners could still find stuff they eat.  Honestly it is a really big space, but so much of it was previously not really usable.  They have gutted the place and been doing a ton of work, I would assume because they realized that.  I probably won't frequent because it's just not the type of food I eat a lot of for lunch.  Previously there was a big bar downstairs that didn't get much traffic, it was kind of dark and not that appealing and then upstairs was never busy enough not to feel awkward.  So we will see.  The one in Dubai was really very pretty.

I think other places in OT that do well have smaller spaces and there are other things in the buildings aka the ice cream shops.  But clearly even good restaurants that have a lot of space there have struggles- see the Eat Good Food Group dilemma.  Long term leases certainly help.

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Huh, Italian in the location of death... well it might have to be a chain to be able to afford that rent.  

Oooohhhh.....as an ex retail and restaurant real estate person I love that "location of death" comment.   There are a lot of them spread around the region...and lord knows when I was starting out in that field I had to try and lease some of them.

Well best of luck to them....but from Kate, who knows the neighborhood, there is bad karma associated with that location. (let alone probably too high rents, too little foot traffic and too much competition--too many too's)  Too bad.

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It's open. I haven't been in yet, but the build out looks impressive from the street.The interior is bright, white and blue, with a market/counter area on the street level and a more formal dining room on the second floor. A few people were in line for breakfast and coffee shortly after 7 am today.

Old Townies are excited about this opening. Hopefully it will be a nice addition to the area AND be able to shake of the 'curse' associated with this location.

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I went the other night because I was craving some carbs and indecisive and didn't want to go far from my office.  Before going I had decided on meatballs, bread basket and another small dish.  But then I had seafood pasta, the seafood was fine, but it was of course bland, I didn't love the tomatoes in the dish, and I thought the pasta was just a little overcooked, but I do like my pasta if it a smaller noodle like that more on the al dente side.  A coworker had recommended the take out sandwiches from the counter area and I was hoping to see the offering just so I knew my options for another day, but I didn't see any at that time.  Anyway it was what I expected- but not in a great way, in a yeah it is middling kind of way.  Perhaps there are better things to order that while not stellar were better.  It really wasn't bad, just overpriced for not being good.    

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Stopped in late last week for a snack during soft opening. Very nice looking room in a "market" setting. We sat at the bar and had a bottle of wine and a veggie board (in a review today, Pete Wells asked what will happen to all those boards when the board fad fades away). Great selection of roasted peppers, green beans, caponata, olives, buffalo mozzarella, focaccia and other stuff I can't remember. Prices for food and wine seemed pretty darn reasonable for this area.

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Dinner at 100 King St in Alexandria tonight with two friends. I know this has been the unfortunate location where other restaurants went to die, but the meal was passable.

First, there wasn't much of a crowd on a Wednesday evening, so we scored a nice four-top out on the sidewalk, where we watched Alexandria stroll by. 

Second, the Italian fare was spare, and the menu is not expansive. Yet, an appetizer of meatballs was lukewarm, at best.

Third, the main course of Salsicci con Peperoni was actually very good, perhaps a bit heavy. Potatoes, sausages, bell peppers....nice! Bring your appetite for this dish.

Old Town is not a dining Mecca, but this place doesn't offend. That said, it would not be my first choice on either side of that block....

 

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First visit to the Pike & Rose location this past Saturday night.  I was shocked to realize they had been open for nine months already!  We only saw a handful of tables besides our own 4-top all night; one larger party and two 2-tops.  

Certainly good company can make for a nice evening in any venue, but we really enjoyed ourselves and were planning our next visit while still at our table.  We even moved from inside the restaurant to an outside table for after-dinner drinks.  The outside tables have heaters and Owen's Ordinary next door has a large outdoor fireplace which kept us comfy on a cool evening.  Our server, Carla, and her management team made us feel like welcomed guests.  Carla was very knowledgeable about the menu and wine list and graciously brought us a number of wine tastes as we struggled to choose a white wine from the menu.  Italian white is not something I know much about and since the wine menu is not on the web site, I wasn't able to do any reconnaissance.   

We ordered both the Salumi and Formaggi boards. The Salumi board is HUGE and actually quite worth its $25 price tag.  The Formaggi board is much more modest, but at least as generous as most of the cheese plates I see around town.  There was nothing unusual in either of these items, but they were solid offerings.  Frankly, these two boards and a couple bottles of wine were probably all we needed...but of course, we pressed onto full entrees.  Three of us had pasta:  an order of lasagna, an order of agnolotti and an order of penne allla luganica.  The lasagna and penne were both excellent.  The agnolotti were filled with burrata and herbs and served in a butter and cream sauce.  While quite tasty, the dish was just too rich to be able to eat more than a bite or two.  I regretted my decision not to order the lasagna of which I only got one small bite before my husband completely devoured it.  He declared it "almost" as good as the lasagna at Floriana..high praise indeed!  

I thought desserts were the weakest offering here, an order of tiramisu was only mediocre at best.  The gelato was okay, but not the rich, creamy dessert that is ubiquitous in Italy.

All in this is my favorite restaurant of the Pike & Rose complex to date.  I'm sure we'll be trying Owen's Ordinary soon, hopefully while it's still nice enough to sit outside an enjoy that enormous outdoor fireplace.   

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Not surprised about the OT location. The reports I heard were 'solid' when it first opened to 'going downhill' shortly after it opened. Then again I am not sure with that rent and square footage that even a great place consistently could keep up the monthly rent.

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5 minutes ago, DanielK said:

First restaurant casualty - there have been several retail closures already.

Technically, Shop House was the first casualty, but I don't know if that really should count.

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17 hours ago, goldenticket said:

The Old Town location has closed - the 100 King Street Curse strikes again.

Or maybe not, as the Pike and Rose location is reported to be closed, too.

3 hours ago, Kev29 said:

Is this the first casualty at Pike & Rose? 

2 hours ago, DanielK said:

First restaurant casualty - there have been several retail closures already.

You know, I may be wrong, and I *hope* I'm wrong, and I'm certainly no economist or urban planner, but I've been doing this for a long time, and have learned to spot economic and developmental trends before they're "recognized" ... I don't like what I see.

cheezepowder's brilliant work first alerted me that something was up a couple of years ago.

Yet, developers seem determined to go full-speed-ahead with Tysons Corner.

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1 hour ago, Finatic said:

There dozens (if not more) of restaurants within blocks of that space! Why can nothing survive there?

Well I would venture to guess 100 King wasn't well run on a business standpoint, and was recession time.  You knew the Thai place that took it's place couldn't support the enormous rent of that building.  Carluccio's redid the layout, somewhat.  But- it was too expensive and didn't have good variety for a work lunch and I think there is a lot of selection for dinner and it just didn't ever wow for the price.  I work a block away and went- once, the next time I went in to try to pick up an Italian sandwich to carry out for lunch, they were out of them (no offer to make me one), so I have never gone back. I think they need a chain restaurant likely to support the rent, it's a big building right in the heart of things.  I think it needs to have a menu that attracts people for lunch, as well though.  I don't think there is a ton of seating, so I would actually think something with quick turnover, or that also has more communal seating would do better than a fancier sit down style restaurant.  That is just my opinion as a lay person.  

We struggle on where to get lunch sometimes- Blackwall takes too long, we don't want the calories of BBQ, Momo is too small for a group, Virtue is pricier than we generally do for most lunches, Fish Market is so-so and touristy as is the Wharf.  We end up at a lot of lunch meetings at Chadwicks, Mai Thai and Union Street based on price point, variety and space.  There are a lot of tourists in that area of Old Town, and there are lots of nicer places, they need a mid to low price point with high turnover that could fill a bigger space, but not a huge one.  

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1 hour ago, ktmoomau said:

 I think they need a chain restaurant likely to support the rent, it's a big building right in the heart of things.  I don't think there is a ton of seating, so I would actually think something with quick turnover, or that also has more communal seating would do better than a fancier sit down style restaurant.  

There are a lot of tourists in that area of Old Town, and there are lots of nicer places, they need a mid to low price point with high turnover that could fill a bigger space, but not a huge one.  

Carluccio's is a 'global chain' (their words) with "more than 80 restaurants in the United Kingdom, Turkey and the United Arab Emirates." With seating on 2 floors, I would have thought it was comparable, if not larger, seating-wise to several of the other spots you mentioned (Chadwick's, Union St., Virtue). Even with efforts to appeal to the U.S. market, it wasn't enough. What kind of chain would survive in that space - of the type that residents would find acceptable?

The city turned down Five Guys in that space before Carluccio's came in, if my memory serves me correctly. The relocated Five Guys (in the former Bertucci's space) seems to be doing quite well. Just add it to the ever-growing list of empty storefronts on King Street from the water to the Metro...

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19 hours ago, goldenticket said:

With seating on 2 floors, I would have thought it was comparable, if not larger, seating-wise to several of the other spots you mentioned (Chadwick's, Union St., Virtue).

Actually no.  Downstairs has a few tables, then the bar area.  The upstairs seating area because of the kitchen is pretty small.  I would compare the seating space to the wine bar across the street.  Certainly nowhere near as close as the others mentioned who all have large seating spaces downstairs and upstairs, maybe even half of their space or less, the seating space is limited.  (I had my engagement party at 100 King upstairs, but I forget what the max number was...)

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37 minutes ago, goldenticket said:

Carluccio's is a 'global chain' (their words) with "more than 80 restaurants in the United Kingdom, Turkey and the United Arab Emirates." With seating on 2 floors, I would have thought it was comparable, if not larger, seating-wise to several of the other spots you mentioned (Chadwick's, Union St., Virtue). Even with efforts to appeal to the U.S. market, it wasn't enough. What kind of chain would survive in that space - of the type that residents would find acceptable?

My guess is that "100 King" is enough of a power address where it needs to be a global chain, running an outlet as a loss leader (like Carluccio's, only I guess not). How can all the terrible, touristy restaurants on the north side of King Street, near the Potomac, survive for so long?

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18 minutes ago, DonRocks said:

My guess is that "100 King" is enough of a power address where it needs to be a global chain, running an outlet as a loss leader (like Carluccio's, only I guess not). How can all the terrible, touristy restaurants on the north side of King Street, near the Potomac, survive for so long?

I hope you are not referring to Landini Brothers! It has been there almost forever, and is probably the premier local hangout. I have been going there for 35 years, +/-. Always treated like family, and they cook a salmon filet as well as any restaurant in town!

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3 hours ago, Finatic said:

I hope you are not referring to Landini Brothers! It has been there almost forever, and is probably the premier local hangout. I have been going there for 35 years, +/-. Always treated like family, and they cook a salmon filet as well as any restaurant in town!

I get the family part, but "salmon filet as well as anyone in town?" Really?

I'm not doubting you; I'm just a little surprised that their salmon is that good, and may want to try it - I've had some awfully good salmon, especially when fresh Alaskan hits the market - seasonal Sockeye Salmon is gloriously red, and almost melts in your mouth. 

Is it "Kinship Salmon and Asparagus" good, or "Sweetwater Tavern Short Stack" good? (Both are fine, but there's a *huge* difference between the two.)

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18 hours ago, DonRocks said:

I get the family part, but "salmon filet as well as anyone in town?" Really?

I'm not doubting you; I'm just a little surprised that their salmon is that good, and may want to try it - I've had some awfully good salmon, especially when fresh Alaskan hits the market - seasonal Sockeye Salmon is gloriously red, and almost melts in your mouth. 

Is it "Kinship Salmon and Asparagus" good, or "Sweetwater Tavern Short Stack" good? (Both are fine, but there's a *huge* difference between the two.)

Not sure why every time I post something you feel the need to disagree with me. Sweetwater over cooks their salmon. Have not had it at Kinship, but I have been there a number of times. Landini's cooks it so it has a bit of a crust but melts in your mouth! Perhaps you should try it before commenting!

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46 minutes ago, Finatic said:

Not sure why every time I post something you feel the need to disagree with me. 

:blink:

How can I disagree with you when I say, "I'm not doubting you," and when I've never before tried their salmon? I even said I may want to try it based on what you wrote - that's not disagreement; that's respect.

I promise you that one of two things are true:

1) You're imagining I'm a Big Bad Wolf when I'm not.
2) You write Big Statements in your posts that surprise me ("as well as any restaurant in town" is a Big Statement). 

I was actually going to write you later today and introduce myself - I recognize your member name, but have absolutely no idea who you are, or what else you've written in the past. Yes, I could look all that up, but I haven't.

I'm in LA, and have a doctor's appointment in 68 minutes that's 45 minutes away. Can we start from scratch, please?

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Truly too bad to see places like that fail - a UK based chain that has done extremely well in the UK.  Perhaps it is as noted, and the failure accompanies other restaurants who have occupied similar spaces.  Oh well, if in the UK and you happen upon a Carluccios - they are typically packed for bfast, lunch or dinner.

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20 minutes ago, weezy said:

Maybe it needs to be something like The Block in Annandale -- 3-4 smaller restaurant operations under one roof, a self-contained food court.

Good idea! The Block is great. A food court with options would be a good setup right there... 

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According to Washington Business Journal (which I can't actually read 😡) the folks from Virtue Feed and Grain are taking over the Carluccio space:

"Here's Who's Taking Over the Former Carluccio's Space in Old Town Alexandria" by Rebecca Cooper on bizjournals.com

It will be interesting to see what concept they go with; especially with Virtue being diagonally across the street. 

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On 6/20/2017 at 6:02 PM, DonRocks said:

My guess is that "100 King" is enough of a power address where it needs to be a global chain, running an outlet as a loss leader (like Carluccio's, only I guess not). How can all the terrible, touristy restaurants on the north side of King Street, near the Potomac, survive for so long?

Yeah, this location has been the kiss of death for restaurants. Alexandria Times did a piece on that recently.

I'm thinking something like a large Shake Shack might work -- quick service for the summer tourist traffic, enough of a pull for the winter locals, and still climbing the national buzz meter.

Clyde's has had success with large-space restaurants and high revenue generation. Maybe the Laythams will take a look at Old Town. Middlin' food but a definite maybe in Old Town, because they don't have any outposts there. Their half priced raw bar during happy hour would take Old Town by storm.

I don't get the feeling Restaurant Eve would take the leap on this place. Of course, some of this speculation is moot for the time being, if Virtue Feed and Grain is coming in....

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22 hours ago, Free Wilma said:

According to Washington Business Journal (which I can't actually read 😡) the folks from Virtue Feed and Grain are taking over the Carluccio space:

"Here's Who's Taking Over the Former Carluccio's Space in Old Town Alexandria" by Rebecca Cooper on bizjournals.com

It will be interesting to see what concept they go with; especially with Virtue being diagonally across the street. 

Alexandria Restaurant Partner's has Vola's which is right across the street, as well.  

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1 hour ago, Kibbee Nayee said:

Yeah, this location has been the kiss of death for restaurants. Alexandria Times did a piece on that recently.

Suggestion for Don: As an accompaniment to your Oldest Restaurants list, how about a Locations of Death list? The cut-off could be 3 or 5 restaurants at the same address.

Example: That building on Lee Hwy that's perpendicular to the street and also cannot be accessed directly from northbound Lee. When I was working in Falls Church that place had at least five different restaurants. Just google mapped the place. It's 5731 Lee Hwy and is currently the home of "Asian Kitchen."

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1 hour ago, Bob Wells said:

Suggestion for Don: As an accompaniment to your Oldest Restaurants list, how about a Locations of Death list? The cut-off could be 3 or 5 restaurants at the same address.

Example: That building on Lee Hwy that's perpendicular to the street and also cannot be accessed directly from northbound Lee. When I was working in Falls Church that place had at least five different restaurants. Just google mapped the place. It's 5731 Lee Hwy and is currently the home of "Asian Kitchen."

Sort of cracks me up...sort of sad.  (As an aside, didn't you work at some point for a commercial real estate operation)

Back in the day when I was a leasing agent and specifically leased retail there were, in my estimation, certain sites that had that dubious reputation and history.  Can't recall them all now, but there have always been locations of that ilk and in all parts of the region.  Cripes when representing some landlords I "knew" that certain sites mostly couldn't cut it--unless they had a uniquely outstanding tenant and most aren't. 

Alternatively there are some terrific restaurants that turn what should be a space that should be retitled from a street address to "waste of rent money"  into a golden destination gem.  I think Pizzeria Orso has accomplished that in Falls Church. 

Come to think of it Ciao Osteria in Centreville, Pasta Plus in Laurel, and Il Pizzico in Rockville all outperform their real estate, with Pasta Plus outperforming that miserable property by about 1 million times

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1 hour ago, DaveO said:

Sort of cracks me up...sort of sad.  (As an aside, didn't you work at some point for a commercial real estate operation)

Back in the day when I was a leasing agent and specifically leased retail there were, in my estimation, certain sites that had that dubious reputation and history.  Can't recall them all now, but there have always been locations of that ilk and in all parts of the region.  Cripes when representing some landlords I "knew" that certain sites mostly couldn't cut it--unless they had a uniquely outstanding tenant and most aren't. 

Alternatively there are some terrific restaurants that turn what should be a space that should be retitled from a street address to "waste of rent money"  into a golden destination gem.  I think Pizzeria Orso has accomplished that in Falls Church. 

Come to think of it Ciao Osteria in Centreville, Pasta Plus in Laurel, and Il Pizzico in Rockville all outperform their real estate, with Pasta Plus outperforming that miserable property by about 1 million times

Great post. Yes, in a former life I was a real estate atty and spend a year in house with an outlet developer. I definitely get into this sort of discussion combining food and RE.

I like your thoughts about the restaurants that outkick the coverage. Ciao is a great, great restaurant. My kid and I get our hair cut a couple doors down at CC's. There are tons of dumpier, shlockier plazas in NOVA. Centrewood is not terrible, but the presence of Ciao is definitely a feather in its cap. Now, before its recent facelift, the Westfax Plaza at 50 between Lee Rd and Avion Parkway in Chantilly could definitely be said to punch above its weight class with Thai Basil and Picante! They did a great job renovating that plaza and making it fit with the one across the street with Pho 98, Cheng's Asian House, and Al Fresco.

I also worked (with the great Warren Rojas) at Tax Analysts, the owner of the Orso building!

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3 hours ago, Bob Wells said:

I also worked (with the great Warren Rojas) at Tax Analysts, the owner of the Orso building!

hah.  I don't know anything about Tax Analyst's that own that property, but getting Orso was a stroke of genius for that desolate side street.   

(never knew that tax experts were such foodies :)  )

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52 minutes ago, DaveO said:

hah.  I don't know anything about Tax Analyst's that own that property, but getting Orso was a stroke of genius for that desolate side street.   

(never knew that tax experts were such foodies :)  )

One block from the Elevation Burger mother ship! I'd say they have done pretty well. This past July I walked by their location in the Old Port section of downtown Portland, ME, where they offer an $18 "Surf & Turf" burger topped with lobster. :o

 I spent nearly 16 years at TA and ate a lot of good food in the Falls Church area.

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3 hours ago, Bob Wells said:

I like your thoughts about the restaurants that outkick the coverage. Ciao is a great, great restaurant. My kid and I get our hair cut a couple doors down at CC's. There are tons of dumpier, shlockier plazas in NOVA. Centrewood is not terrible, but the presence of Ciao is definitely a feather in its cap.

I agree.  Centrewood is not bad at all, especially compared to the other sites mentioned.  Orso is in a nice building, its just that the block is so forgettable and it is a side street.  The Md referenced restaurants are in poor to utterly miserable strips.  Pasta Plus should be paid by the property owner for keeping that site from being fire bombed and demolished.

Centrewood looks like a strip center that Giant's own real estate department used to build, before Giant was sold.  Probably not coincidentally the grandson of Giant's founder probably still owns the center (since 2000) and it is professionally managed and leased. 

I know nothing at all about current rents out there, but if there is justice in this world (assuming justice has anything to do with real estate rents) I do hope the tenant isn't paying % rents or has it capped.  That is a great restaurant and from what I know is doing boffo revenues, justifiably so.  The operators deserve the revenues not the landlord.  ;)

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On 8/28/2017 at 1:19 PM, Bob Wells said:

Suggestion for Don: As an accompaniment to your Oldest Restaurants list, how about a Locations of Death list? The cut-off could be 3 or 5 restaurants at the same address.

And then sometimes one operator turns a lemon into lemonade.

I walked by Courthouse Social at Happy Hour today.  It's in Courthouse on Clarendon Blvd on a block and cross the street from Ray's, Me Jana, and Fireworks.  Quite a number of failed restaurants in that particular space even as others do well.  If I can't name them all I can think of 3 in the last 15 yrs with Velocity 5 being the most recent.

Tonight I'd estimate 150-200 people indoors and outside.  It's trivia night.  This place is packed.  It's often packed.

Courthouse Social broke the curse

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On 8/28/2017 at 1:19 PM, Bob Wells said:

Suggestion for Don: As an accompaniment to your Oldest Restaurants list, how about a Locations of Death list? The cut-off could be 3 or 5 restaurants at the same address.

Example: That building on Lee Hwy that's perpendicular to the street and also cannot be accessed directly from northbound Lee. When I was working in Falls Church that place had at least five different restaurants. Just google mapped the place. It's 5731 Lee Hwy and is currently the home of "Asian Kitchen."

I live near Asian Kitchen and noted as I ran by it last week that it seems to have defied gravity for longer than I would have guessed. The turnover in that space through the years has been notable. I wouldn't have guessed that this place would have made it so long. 

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52 minutes ago, DannyNoonan said:

I live near Asian Kitchen and noted as I ran by it last week that it seems to have defied gravity for longer than I would have guessed. The turnover in that space through the years has been notable. I wouldn't have guessed that this place would have made it so long. 

Don't forget that they're owned by Ichiban, which also has a restaurant in Shirlington.

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