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On the way home from work and daycare this evening, the +1/4 and I stopped off at Heidelberg for a couple of cookies for her. At 5pm. the staff at Heidelberg were putting out trays of things that hadn't sold during the day to sell at 50% off. I picked up a large chocolate cupcake with a smooth smear of chocolate frosting on top. When we cut it in half at home, the cake part was rich and chocolatey with a slightly smaller than a golf ball sized sphere of chocolate ganache baked into the middle. Oh my. This was good. And huge. And a bargain even at its full price of $1.85. The only downside of this delicious treat was the icing on top, which was a bit sugary for my taste but which my husband found to his liking.

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stopped into the dairy godmother today to have some carrot cake custard and found carrot cake cupcakes with cream cheese icing as well. She's also been doing really excellent chocolate with cream cheese filling and a rich chocolate icing.

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stopped into the dairy godmother today to have some carrot cake custard and found carrot cake cupcakes with cream cheese icing as well. She's also been doing really excellent chocolate with cream cheese filling and a rich chocolate icing.

I had the chocolate cupcake yesterday. It was yummy though I don't like cream cheese the filling was clever because there were chocolate chips in it! Nice touch. I think the baked goods are really good at Dairy Godmother.
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I still don't get the whole cupcake thing. I must be the only one, because from what I have read about Georgetown Cupcake, it sounds like they are overwhelmed with customers. It just seems odd to me that people will wait in line for over an hour for a cupcake. I think people just like to say the word "cupcake", maybe for nostalgic reasons....

Maybe I am just jealous as to how busy these cupcakes places are. I don't know.

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Are cupcakes on the trite foods list yet?
No, they're tired, but some trends endure. Cf. women in black pants. Krisp Kreme doughnuts not made on the premises, on the other hand...
I still don't get the whole cupcake thing.
I totally get it. Like you know you've got your cake? And your frosting? And you can get just one just for yourself? For $3? Gooey and moist. No need to share or compare sizes of slices with your friend's. You get to choose your flavors? Sweet!

What I don't get is the fact that here in this big city of ours with all the great restaurants, by now there ought to be really great bakeries and pastry shops in every neighborhood. The Best Of choices in The City Paper should make us hang our heads in shame or move to Seattle, Yontville, Portland or Paris.

And how come no one's given us a great deli, yet?

While I still haven't made it to the franchise in Georgetown for baguettes, nor tried one pastry shop in Adams Morgan (right?) that receives praise, the best place I've found to buy bread and pastry in D.C. is at Penn Quarter on Thursdays as close to 3 PM as possible. We ought to have better storefront options.

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I get the Magnolia cupcake thing. They remind me of the cupcakes my mother used to make from mix with very sweet frosting. The colors are cheerful and the cupcakes are always sweet and moist. They never fail to cheer me.

DC cupcakes on the other end never fail to depress me. I haven't tried Georgetown yet and I will try this place when it opens. But really, I just need someone in NY to send me a Magnolia or Billy's Bakery fix once in a while.

Jennifer, still depressed that a blown out tire and inlaws who wanted to play with their grandson kept her from making a cupcake run on her last trip to NY...

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While I still haven't made it to the franchise in Georgetown for baguettes, nor tried one pastry shop in Adams Morgan (right?) that receives praise, the best place I've found to buy bread and pastry in D.C. is at Penn Quarter on Thursdays as close to 3 PM as possible. We ought to have better storefront options.
I know of some secret, non-permitted, non-storefront operations. ;)
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What I don't get is the fact that here in this big city of ours with all the great restaurants, by now there ought to be really great bakeries and pastry shops in every neighborhood. The Best Of choices in The City Paper should make us hang our heads in shame or move to Seattle, Yontville, Portland or Paris.

I couldn't agree more. There is not one good, high-end pastry shop in the entire metro area. I think there are plenty of average places, but nothing that really stands out. I guess what bothers me is that these cupcake places are incredibly busy and popular for something that (IMHO) doesn't take much skill to make, yet folks still shell out $3+ for a little bite of nostalgia. The other problem I have is that most of these placess are owned/operated by people w/o any sort of pastry or food background. The most popular places are run by "former tax attorney, former fashion designer, former...." When is someone going to open a place who was a "former pastry chef"? Don't get me wrong, I am happy to see these independent businesses open up and be profitable and I have no personal ill-will toward anyone that goes out on their own to open up shop. More power to them. Sorry, stepping down from soapbox now.

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Fact is, people like dessert places you can stroll in and out of after dinner, on a weekend afternoon, etc. There are really not that many places like that around. If a fancy cupcake place opened in Clarendon I can't imagine how much money it would make, especially if it stayed open till midnight on weekends. For those of you who have not lived in NYC, you would not believe the lines at Mag, Mary's off Jane and others late night.

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I guess what bothers me is that these cupcake places are incredibly busy and popular for something that (IMHO) doesn't take much skill to make,

And what bothers me is that so many of these places turn out a product that I wouldn't pay two bits for. Cupcakes shouldn't take much skill, yes, so why are the commercial ones always so... so... disappointing?

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I am definitely on board the whole cupcake phenomenon (actually, I'm trying to convince my office that for birthdays instead of spending a lot of money on a cake that's not that great, we should just get like 20 different flavored cupcakes instead and let people choose their flavor).

I'm looking forward to trying this place out since it defintiely has some intriguing flavors. Right now my co-workers and I make a trip every now and then to Lawson's by Metro Center. Their red velvet cupcakse are amazing (a little disappointed there's no Red Velvet on the menu at HC).

I still can't imagine standing in line for an hour for a cupcake though.

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Cupcakes are not trite. Overly cutesy shops that sell only cupcakes and charge $4 each may be. But don't blame the innocent cupcakes.

I personally don't plan to wait on any more cupcake lines, but I suspect this place will be slammed.

Echoing the call here for more neighborhood bakeries. High end bakeries are fine, but the majority of the time, I'm just looking for a simple cake (or some cupcakes) or a pound of cookies to bring along to a casual dinner party. It's kind of sad when the only places I can think of to grab a variety of baked goods in a time pinch are Giant and Whole Foods. Reeves, even though it was inconsistent toward the end, was my go-to place.

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I still don't get the whole cupcake thing.

It's the same reason I can be delicately sipping my consomme at Palena lounge, and be staring down an entire barful of cheeseburgers: something primal that hearkens back to the easy comforts of childhood.

Which would you rather have, one of these signed Miro etchings, or this Topps 1952 Mickey Mantle? Might want to rethink that answer...

Cheers,

Rocks.

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Cupcakes are not trite. Overly cutesy shops that sell only cupcakes and charge $4 each may be. But don't blame the innocent cupcakes.

I guess that is my point. I have no problem with the innocent cupcake. I enjoyed them as a kid, my kids like them, my wife likes them, yadda, yadda....

What I don't understand is why people get all jacked up about these cupcake shops. I mean there are like over 100 posts on Chowhound about Georgetown Cupcake. Folks wait in line forever to pay $3+ for something they can probably make better at home. Honestly, the best cupcakes I have ever had were the ones at some kids b-day party, made from Duncan Hines mix with store bought frosting from a tin. The cupcakes at "insert boutique cupcake shop here" made with all natural ingredients, real creamery butter (no shortening!), and all that BS basically amount to a dry-ass, overpriced cupcake. Even the ones I had at Magnolia Bakery a few years ago were just okay in my book. Different strokes for different folks, but I still don't get the trend.

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I guess that is my point. I have no problem with the innocent cupcake. I enjoyed them as a kid, my kids like them, my wife likes them, yadda, yadda....

What I don't understand is why people get all jacked up about these cupcake shops. I mean there are like over 100 posts on Chowhound about Georgetown Cupcake. Folks wait in line forever to pay $3+ for something they can probably make better at home. Honestly, the best cupcakes I have ever had were the ones at some kids b-day party, made from Duncan Hines mix with store bought frosting from a tin. The cupcakes at "insert boutique cupcake shop here" made with all natural ingredients, real creamery butter (no shortening!), and all that BS basically amount to a dry-ass, overpriced cupcake. Even the ones I had at Magnolia Bakery a few years ago were just okay in my book. Different strokes for different folks, but I still don't get the trend.

A-fucking-men.

I agree with Mark, the best cupcake I have had from a shop in DC was at Baked and Wired, but it was still not as good as the funfetti cupcakes my mom made growing up and it is still a ripoff at $3 and change. Waiting in line for more than 5 minutes for something like this is just too absurd for me to comprehend.

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I'm not in the baking business, but just off the top of my head, I'd guess that the cupcake has some advantages over slices of a whole cake. 1. You can eat a cupcake with one hand and no plates or utensils, so it is good for carryout = more $/sq ft of store. 2. People watching their weight will rationalize away one cupcake, rather than buying a whole cake and having to look at it in the fridge all week.

As to why there aren't more bakeries/butcheries selling great food, I think it again comes down to economics. Making great bread or running a great butcher shop is very, very labor intensive and very exhusting, and people don't seem to want to pay for the difference. You can get an edible machine-made baguette in this town for $2.00 or so. Given that, how many are willing to pay $5.00 or whatever for one that is had-made and awesome? Probably a lot of us on here, but I bet not enough of us to make it worth someone working 16 hour days. You can only sell bread for so much.

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I agree have most of them and the cake always seems to be dry but the frosting is so much better.

Would love to just buy the frosting and make my own.

I guess that is my point. I have no problem with the innocent cupcake. I enjoyed them as a kid, my kids like them, my wife likes them, yadda, yadda....

What I don't understand is why people get all jacked up about these cupcake shops. I mean there are like over 100 posts on Chowhound about Georgetown Cupcake. Folks wait in line forever to pay $3+ for something they can probably make better at home. Honestly, the best cupcakes I have ever had were the ones at some kids b-day party, made from Duncan Hines mix with store bought frosting from a tin. The cupcakes at "insert boutique cupcake shop here" made with all natural ingredients, real creamery butter (no shortening!), and all that BS basically amount to a dry-ass, overpriced cupcake. Even the ones I had at Magnolia Bakery a few years ago were just okay in my book. Different strokes for different folks, but I still don't get the trend.

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I guess that is my point. I have no problem with the innocent cupcake. I enjoyed them as a kid, my kids like them, my wife likes them, yadda, yadda....

What I don't understand is why people get all jacked up about these cupcake shops. I mean there are like over 100 posts on Chowhound about Georgetown Cupcake. Folks wait in line forever to pay $3+ for something they can probably make better at home. Honestly, the best cupcakes I have ever had were the ones at some kids b-day party, made from Duncan Hines mix with store bought frosting from a tin. The cupcakes at "insert boutique cupcake shop here" made with all natural ingredients, real creamery butter (no shortening!), and all that BS basically amount to a dry-ass, overpriced cupcake. Even the ones I had at Magnolia Bakery a few years ago were just okay in my book. Different strokes for different folks, but I still don't get the trend.

Well, first of all, not everyone is as jacked up about "these cupcake shops" as it appears you are jacked up against them. Generalizations are never a good thing. I do understand your disdain for why folks would choose to wait an hour in line for a dry tasteless piece of crap. But have you even checked out Hello Cupcake's website yet, before you skewer their right to exist?

A few thoughts:

1) not all the cupcakes are bad--if you're talking cakelove, I agree.

2) $3 seems expensive, except when you look at the prices charged for food working in a downtown urban area. I mean, people pay $5 for a Ben and Jerry's ice cream, which is not my cup of tea. And $5+ for fancy coffee drinks. Just today I wanted something cool for dessert while out on my walk, and a small shop was charging $4 for a small gelato. That's the way of life working dowtown. I don't have to like it, but ain't nothing I can do 'bout it.

3) Sometimes I'll crave a dessert from lunch, and picking up a cupcake is very desirable. (see above--$4 for a small gelato!) What--you thiink I'm gonna buy a whole cake for dessert on a whim?

4) Someone else mentioned it above, but we also have the need to have cakes and such to celebrate bdays in our office. Just last month I had to swing by WF to buy cupcakes because we wanted to do something different. And I can tell you we didn't have the option of flavors.

5) Since when are all cupcakes so easy to make? If making a gourmet cupcake with fancy sugar decorations, how does that differ from making a large cake? Except for the fact that there would actually be more decorations to make, which I would think make it more difficult.

6) "(no shortening!)" is extremely valuable and important to those, like myself and BrettAshley, who are allergic to soy. Many people do not realize that soybean oil is a main ingredient in shortening and margarine.

While I'm sure this thread will be great free PR for the new shop, I reallly wish Don would split off the generalized cupcake comments from the Hello Cupcake thread. I am happy to have a place in walking distance to get dessert that I am not allergic to (those of you who know me understand how nice a treat that is ;) ) and to have an option that is close to the office to pick up for bday parties. Now after being excited for this opportunity, I just hope the cupcakes taste better than Cakelove! <gets down from soapbox>

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I think perhaps cupcakes are in need of rebranding, because the term cupcake seems to be deeply associated with the duncan-hines/funfetti variety. What about "cakelings" or "junior pastries"?

Also, I'm down with no shortening cause, straight up, shortening grosses me out.

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Well, first of all, not everyone is as jacked up about "these cupcake shops" as it appears you are jacked up against them. Generalizations are never a good thing. I do understand your disdain for why folks would choose to wait an hour in line for a dry tasteless piece of crap. But have you even checked out Hello Cupcake's website yet, before you skewer their right to exist?

A few thoughts:

1) not all the cupcakes are bad--if you're talking cakelove, I agree.

2) $3 seems expensive, except when you look at the prices charged for food working in a downtown urban area. I mean, people pay $5 for a Ben and Jerry's ice cream, which is not my cup of tea. And $5+ for fancy coffee drinks. Just today I wanted something cool for dessert while out on my walk, and a small shop was charging $4 for a small gelato. That's the way of life working dowtown. I don't have to like it, but ain't nothing I can do 'bout it.

3) Sometimes I'll crave a dessert from lunch, and picking up a cupcake is very desirable. (see above--$4 for a small gelato!) What--you thiink I'm gonna buy a whole cake for dessert on a whim?

4) Someone else mentioned it above, but we also have the need to have cakes and such to celebrate bdays in our office. Just last month I had to swing by WF to buy cupcakes because we wanted to do something different. And I can tell you we didn't have the option of flavors.

5) Since when are all cupcakes so easy to make? If making a gourmet cupcake with fancy sugar decorations, how does that differ from making a large cake? Except for the fact that there would actually be more decorations to make, which I would think make it more difficult.

6) "(no shortening!)" is extremely valuable and important to those, like myself and BrettAshley, who are allergic to soy. Many people do not realize that soybean oil is a main ingredient in shortening and margarine.

While I'm sure this thread will be great free PR for the new shop, I reallly wish Don would split off the generalized cupcake comments from the Hello Cupcake thread. I am happy to have a place in walking distance to get dessert that I am not allergic to (those of you who know me understand how nice a treat that is ;) ) and to have an option that is close to the office to pick up for bday parties. Now after being excited for this opportunity, I just hope the cupcakes taste better than Cakelove! <gets down from soapbox>

I agree this thread should be separated from the Hello Cupcake thread. Again, I would hate for anything that I (or anyone else) says to have a negative impact on a business. This was not meant to be a personal attack on Hello Cupcake, as I don't know them and of course I hope the are successful in their endevour.

Yes, I have checked out their website. It is very nice.

I never said "everyone" is jacked up.... But let's face it, these cupcake places DO get a lot of media attention and in turn a lot of customers. I even think there was a whole article about them in New York Magazine (or the New Yorker?). So maybe "jacked up" is a strong word. Let's just say "attention".

I agree with your points about getting a quick, sweet snack. I think we need more dessert options in the DC Metro area.

I guess what this all comes down to is the notion of the "gourmet cupcake". Is there really such a thing? Does the cupcake need to be gourmet (and therefore expensive) to be good (or better) than the ones we all remember from childhood. It sort of reminds me of the "Kobe Beef Hot Dog".....

And finally, and I think I stated this in the first post I made in this thread, maybe I am just a bit jealous of the popularity of these gourmet cupcake joints.....

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I am down with any kind of cake-product, as long as it is delicious. If these $3 cupcakes - or any cupcakes, for that matter - are worth standing in line for, and the pastry shop is conveniently located in my 'hood, I would be all over it.

Also, saying that you don't like cupcakes because they are trite is like saying you don't like a band because they "sold out". Only in this case, it's more retarded because you are talking about CAKE. Cake doesn't need to be hardcore, it only needs to be delicious. Then again, I am one of "those people" who drinks $5 coffee and even I ate some mini-burgers last week, so wtf do I know? ;)

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The answer is obvious. You should get on the bandwagon and start selling cupcakes in your store ;)
Nope. We are going to sell chocolate dipped Kobe Beef Hot Dogs (on a stick....)

And I thought the obvious answer was that Jason needs to open a shop downtown, lessee--walking distance from 19th and L would be perfect! That should take care of needing more dessert options in the DC metro area :)

(I would love to try your chocolates, BTW...someday, when I make it 'cross the river...)

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This topic is sort of becoming a Why Don't We Have Lots of Great Bakeries in Town?

In that vein, I spoke to one of my favorites yesterday, Wes of The Ovens at Quail Creek Farm. He said that he's been urged to open up a place in D.C., most recently by Wolfgang Puck after his new restaurant-launch introduced him to the Penn Quarter market.

However, according to his research, he would have to pay around $35,000 a month in rent to occupy a space close to the chefs who like his wares. Couldn't see that happening.

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This topic is sort of becoming a Why Don't We Have Lots of Great Bakeries in Town?

In that vein, I spoke to one of my favorites yesterday, Wes of The Ovens at Quail Creek Farm. He said that he's been urged to open up a place in D.C., most recently by Wolfgang Puck after his new restaurant-launch introduced him to the Penn Quarter market.

However, according to his research, he would have to pay around $35,000 a month in rent to occupy a space close to the chefs who like his wares. Couldn't see that happening.

Wolfgang should pay his rent for him. He can easily afford it.

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This topic is sort of becoming a Why Don't We Have Lots of Great Bakeries in Town?

In that vein, I spoke to one of my favorites yesterday, Wes of The Ovens at Quail Creek Farm. He said that he's been urged to open up a place in D.C., most recently by Wolfgang Puck after his new restaurant-launch introduced him to the Penn Quarter market.

However, according to his research, he would have to pay around $35,000 a month in rent to occupy a space close to the chefs who like his wares. Couldn't see that happening.

Interesting. I wonder with all the lobby shop and law firm kitchens in town (not all of them have kitchens, but some of the big ones do) if an enterprising baker could lease time to bake when the kitchens are dark. Could probably get a rate if you allocated some tasty bread to the senior partners each day...

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Interesting. I wonder with all the lobby shop and law firm kitchens in town (not all of them have kitchens, but some of the big ones do) if an enterprising baker could lease time to bake when the kitchens are dark. Could probably get a rate if you allocated some tasty bread to the senior partners each day...

Even law firms with big kitchens aren't set up with the kind of equipment needed to bake bread. The upswing is that anyone opening a bakery that catered breakfasts and lunches around there would make a mint off those firms. The numbers being discussed here are a bit inflated - you could open a space the size of Breadline in Penn Quarter for about $15k a month in rent, $10k or even lower if it were set up more as a commercial operation on a 2nd floor or basement.

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[Everyone STOP TRIPLE SPACING!]
Who you calling "everyone"? ;) Please don't shout at shrimp and clams since they usually don't know better and tend to quiver in their shells. The rest of us can take it and await whatever penitential measures you deem appropriate. :)
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How do you fix marine life? I find it hard enough distinguishing male from female specimens! (N.B. This message was written by back-spacing to re-position the code for the end-quote so that it's in the same line as the quote, then starting my response on the line.)
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I don't go around sampling cupcakes on a regular basis, so I can't speak from personal experience on the relative merits of gourmet cupcakes versus the box-mix variety. However, I did recently see Channel 4's blind taste testing of Cakelove, Georgetown Cupcakes, Safeway, and Betty Crocker mix.

Full article and video linked below, but the quick version is that of 40 testers, seven each picked Safeway ($0.58 each) and the Betty Crocker mix ($0.20) as their preference. Georgetown Cupcakes ($2.42) was the preference of 21 - a clear and decisive victory. Cakelove ($2.77) was picked by only 5 people.

http://www.nbc4.com/money/15948151/detail.html

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I don't go around sampling cupcakes on a regular basis, so I can't speak from personal experience on the relative merits of gourmet cupcakes versus the box-mix variety. However, I did recently see Channel 4's blind taste testing of Cakelove, Georgetown Cupcakes, Safeway, and Betty Crocker mix.

Full article and video linked below, but the quick version is that of 40 testers, seven each picked Safeway ($0.58 each) and the Betty Crocker mix ($0.20) as their preference. Georgetown Cupcakes ($2.42) was the preference of 21 - a clear and decisive victory. Cakelove ($2.77) was picked by only 5 people.

http://www.nbc4.com/money/15948151/detail.html

Did anyone else view agm's link? I found it interesting that the comments received weren't mostly about the texture of the cake, but rather, the taste and flavor/texture of the frosting.
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After all of my cupake shop bashing, I decided to try out Georgetown Cupcake after I ate lunch at the Tacke Box on Friday afternoon. There was only one person in front of me in line, and it seemd like they had about 8-10 flavors available. I got 6 to try out and take home (mainly for the wife and kids). I have to say, they were all pretty damn good. The cake was fairly moist and I liked the cream cheese icing (which wasn't overly sweet). These cupcakes blow Cakelove cupcakes out of the water. Would I make a special trip to get cupcakes? No. Would I wait in line for a hour for cupcakes? No. However, I liked the small shop and I think they are making a very good product. Am I a hypocrite? Yes.

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I thought I would just add my bit to this topic...

I have bought cupcakes from Georgetown Cupcake, Hello Cupcake, and Red Velvet all within the last two weeks (at least 3 from each place).

In order of preference, I rank them:

1. Georgetown Cupcake-- very moist cake and the frosting wasn't too thick or too sweet. I am wondering though if they actually soak their cupcakes in simple syrup after they cook them. If not, their moist cake is a pretty good feat of physics. This is definitely not something I could replicate at home and the flavors were really good. A bit on the smaller side, but that's probably a good thing and what contributes to making it a great cupcake.

2. Red Velvet-- cake isn't as moist as the Georgetown Cupcake, but the flavors are good. Frosting is definitely fresh and made from scratch. Looks like something I could probably make at home.

3. Hello Cupcake-- cake is a bit dry and lacking in flavor (but not Love Cafe-flavorless) and there was way too much oversweet frosting for me. The only good one my wife and I had was the carrot cake one. My sister made cupcakes for my wife and I the week before (from scratch), and I would say her cupcakes were better than the ones from here.

As a frame of reference, I rank Love Cafe well below Hello Cupcake.

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I recently bought a dozen cupcakes at the Georgetown Cupcake place to bring to Georgetown Hospital. It was to be a surprise for my nurses on my last day of my treatment after two years of monthly infusions. I said again and again that I had never eaten a cupcake from there myself but that I had heard they were very good and hoped that it was true. I was a little nervous because normally, I never give food to anyone if I haven't sampled the goods myself at some point. :P

Well, they raved! :P At their suggestion, I tried one and found the cake to be really moist and the frosting to taste as though it was made from real ingredients - no chemical, too sweet aftertaste.

The nurses said I was there heroine :o as many patients leave at the end of their treatment and never say thanks or even goodbye. :D

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Cake Dreams on West Montgomery Ave in Rockville (same parking lot as Bombay Bistro) has a nice selection of cupcakes in the storefront, though it seems primarily to be a custom order shop. I tried a chocolate with coconut; the cake was deep, dark, but not dense, with a plain icing sprinkled with coconut. Those who view cupcakes as a vehicle for icing delivery may be disappointed, while others (like me) who see icing as a complement to the cake will be pleased. I haven't tried any other flavors yet. Saving them for breakfast (might need a good sugar rush for shoveling the driveway). ...well, okay, I did have a taste of the mocha icing, which was intensely coffee flavored. Nice.

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Baked and Wired is still the best. And they have bee stings.

I too am a Baked and Wired fan. Love their cupcakes and pie too.

As for Georgetown Cupcake, I may be in the minority, but tend to think it''s over rated. Maybe it's because I haven't enjoyed waiting in long lines for rather tiny cupcakes and just OK service. Or it could be that I didn't have a good impression of GC when it ran out of cupcakes at the Taste of Georgetown event last summer,which meant either wasting several hours in line at the shop later the same day or losing money spent on tickets for the cupcakes.

In any case, I prefer either Baked and Wired's cupcakes or Furin's old-fashioned, normal-sized cupcakes. No fuss, no wait, and no hype.

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Great cupcakes around DC

baked and wired - g'town - big, dense and sugary frosting

The General Store- silver spring - light w sugary buttercream frost and a hint of sea salt

Sub Urban trading company-Kensington- light, not too sweet has both cream cheese and buttercream frost

fancy cakes by Leslie-Bethesda - moist, sweet and very unique toppings including edible glitter that sparkles when you eat them outside

buzz- haven't been much but know there is some real talent in that kitchen

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