Ray's the Steaks and Retro Ray's (Next Door) - Michael Landrum's Steakhouses in Courthouse - Closed

[SeanMike]

Huh the website (and door) do say 5:30.

I hit it early to say hi to Mark Slater and check out the spot. Hung out for a couple of hours, got an impromptu sherry and madeira lesson from Mark (lesson learned THEY ARE DELICIOUS) and tried the culette (colette? celotte? I have no idea how to spell it and of course forgot to look at the receipt). It's the outer part of the ribeye. (I see now a post that says Ziebold calls it the calotte, maybe?)

Okay, so pertinent points other than spelling: the menu is smaller, it appears, than next door, but not by much. Prices are lower - the onglet, for instance, is $16.99. (My cut I can't spell was $28.99, but was so rich I could only eat half of it - and it came with the standard mashed potatoes and creamed spinach.) There are several wines in each category by the glass, including port, sherry, and madeira. There is some liquor - maybe about a dozen bottles - with some sodas, but do not expect craft cocktails. Also a few beers in bottles.

The bar looks into the meat cooler, so you get to check out the sides of beef. Yummy.

I had a ton of fun hanging out with Mark and a chance to talk to Michael a lot. The place has only been open since Thursday (and it's closed Sundays and Mondays). Honestly, I'll be most interested to see how the crowds hold out for the bar seats - there were a growing number of folks sitting at tables when I left, but I prefer to eat at the bar when I'm solo and so I am curious how that holds up.

Basically? I thought it was cool. If I can hang out at a bar with this kind of wine list (my wine of the night: The "Ball Buster" at $8 a glass) and have a steak or something and relax, I'll be here a lot more often than I'd normally go to Ray's.

[Michael Landrum]

Still got my Nike Boots: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7I1QxABdYYc&feature=relmfu

[Michael Landrum]

What time is it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saRt2Vhrvxc

[Rovers2000]

I stopped into "Retro Ray's" last night and like SeanMike above was impressed. As a solo dinner looking for a satisfying meal on my way to an event out in Arlington, this was perfect. I walked in around 630 and there were multiple open seats at the bar. Ordered the Cab blend and the Pirhanna top sirloin (I love this sauce...love love love it) along with a cup of the crab bisque.

The service was excellent and getting to chat with Mark briefly (the place had definitely filled up by the time I was getting my check at 730, both the tables and bar stools were filled) was a nice way to finish my meal. I really liked, as a single diner on this night, being able to grab a seat at the bar and I'll definitely be back when I'm in the area by myself.

[Drive-by Critic]

Big thanks to Miss T, the hostess with the mostest at R3^d.

I planned to have lunch with a business colleague from out of town who happens to love Ray's Hellburger and wanted to try Ray's to the Third. Due to her schedule, we planned to meet at 11:30. I arrived before she did, not having checked the hours before making the plans, to find a sign on the door saying that lunch service started at noon. I poked my head in the door to ask if we could sit and talk until noon, and the very gracious Miss T said that they would be glad to serve us lunch at 11:30. And of course they did and of course it was fantastic. Now admittedly, I would be making a repeat visit anyway, but I have to say that encountering incredibly lovely and helpful staff is the icing on the cake. Miss T - you really made our day. Thanks again for taking such good care of the customers.

[darkstar965]

I hit it early to say hi to Mark Slater and check out the spot. Hung out for a couple of hours, got an impromptu sherry and madeira lesson from Mark (lesson learned THEY ARE DELICIOUS) and tried the culette (colette? celotte? I have no idea how to spell it and of course forgot to look at the receipt). It's the outer part of the ribeye. (I see now a post that says Ziebold calls it the calotte, maybe?)

Okay, so pertinent points other than spelling: the menu is smaller, it appears, than next door, but not by much. Prices are lower - the onglet, for instance, is $16.99. (My cut I can't spell was $28.99, but was so rich I could only eat half of it - and it came with the standard mashed potatoes and creamed spinach.) There are several wines in each category by the glass, including port, sherry, and madeira. There is some liquor - maybe about a dozen bottles - with some sodas, but do not expect craft cocktails. Also a few beers in bottles.

<snip>I'll be here a lot more often than I'd normally go to Ray's.

Do you mean "culotte?" If so, that's the same cut they serve at Medium Rare. It's cut from the sirloin I think but, irregardless of that, it's good!

I stopped into "Retro Ray's" last night and like SeanMike above was impressed.

Looking forward to a fuller report about this newest launch because, from the above and the website announcement, not sure I get it? Is it basically just overflow for burger/third/steaks with a more limited menu? Or is there something totally new and different about it? Was most recently at R23 last week and really enjoyed it as always.

[dcs]

Looking forward to a fuller report about this newest launch because, from the above and the website announcement, not sure I get it? Is it basically just overflow for burger/third/steaks with a more limited menu? Or is there something totally new and different about it? Was most recently at R23 last week and really enjoyed it as always.

Per ARLnow.com:

The menu for Retro Ray’s looks very much like that of Ray’s the Steaks. In fact, it is the Ray’s the Steaks menu — from 2005. The offerings and the prices match that of the old 1725 Wilson Boulevard Ray’s the Steaks, circa 2005, we’re told.

[SeanMike]

Do you mean "culotte?" If so, that's the same cut they serve at Medium Rare. It's cut from the sirloin I think but, irregardless of that, it's good!

No, it's definitely from the ribeye. I think it is calotte.

Looking forward to a fuller report about this newest launch because, from the above and the website announcement, not sure I get it? Is it basically just overflow for burger/third/steaks with a more limited menu? Or is there something totally new and different about it? Was most recently at R23 last week and really enjoyed it as always.

As dcs points out, it's more like Ray's 2005. Though I don't remember the devilishly good eggs on the menu back the first time I went to Ray's (which would've been 2006, maybe?). It's just steaks, a couple of seafood dishes, and a few appetizers. No burgers, chicken, etc.

And cheaper prices. And liquor. And a bar.

[MsDiPesto]

From "The Cooks Thesaurus":

coulotte steak = culotte steak = culottes steak = top sirloin cap steak Notes: This is a small, boneless steak cut from the sirloin. It's got good flavor, but it's a bit tougher than other steaks so you might want to marinate before cooking it. Substitutes: sirloin steak

[dcs]

From "The Cooks Thesaurus":

coulotte steak = culotte steak = culottes steak = top sirloin cap steak Notes: This is a small, boneless steak cut from the sirloin. It's got good flavor, but it's a bit tougher than other steaks so you might want to marinate before cooking it. Substitutes: sirloin steak

It can get more complicated.

[durwoodx]

Also it should be mentioned that the "Retro" Bistro has a full (but limited) bar. Translation: pre-steak manhattans are in my future.

[MsDiPesto]

It can get more complicated.

Damn. I'm redacting my previous remark.

[u-bet!]

I walked in around 630 and there were multiple open seats at the bar.

Say "Hi" next time.

There were even fewer people when I walked in about 20 minutes before you. I wonder if that will continue or if it will start filling up earlier and earlier? I was too tempted by the offering of a dry-aged ribeye to take advantage of the opportunity to snag my usual go-to House Special at the old price, so ironically enough, my bill was the highest it's been among my solo visits to the various incarnations and locations of RTS (OK, so I gluttoned it up by having the Devilishly Good Eggs [$9.99] as a starter, 3 glasses of the Ball Buster [$9.00 each], and Dark Chocolate Mousse for dessert [$6.00], all of which were worth every penny). Still the dry-aged "Sidekick" as it was identified on the check, at $35.99 was a bargain. I love the horseradish cream which was served alongside, but the flavor of the steak was so intense, I made sure to eat more than a few unadorned bites. According to my brief conversation with Mark, the plan (if I understood him correctly) is for the main space to become reservations-only, and the Bistro will take walk-ins. My only complaint: Why no coffee?

[SeanMike]

East River reopened:

http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/youngandhungry/2012/01/30/michael-landrum-reopens-rays-the-steaks-at-east-river/

[bookluvingbabe]

There is one thing that would make Ray's 3, or whatever it is called, better.

Chocolate mousse.

Really, the milkshakes are nice.

But I would really, really, really love it if I could get the mousse at all of the Ray's establishments.

I'd probably weight 400 pounds. But I'd be a happy 400 pounds.

[jasonc]

On that note, am I the only one a little bothered by the fact that Rays' milkshakes are made from a mix?

[eyedubya]

Walking to a company hour in Clarendon. Thought about grabbing a glass of wine at Ray's, but figure I should get to the company gig. Then I saw a sign for Ray's retro. Poked my nose in to see what it was, and now I find myself at the bar pummeling a hanger steak. Brewer-Clifton pinot for $56, that's just unfair.

[pidgey]

East River reopened:

http://www.washingto...-at-east-river/

Yes! We ended up dining there last week impromptu. The menu was still limited (no dessert at the time, but there were plans to do so), and a full bar. I actually didn't see much difference in the menu pre-closing as I thought I would. Also, there seemed to be a lack of sides...mashed potatoes at East River please! As I've said before, this is a great option for those of us in Capitol Hill and surrounding environs to enjoy a Ray's steak, but don't expect the full Ray's experience.

[SeanMike]

Six of us hit Ray's last night. Showing up around 7:30, it took us about an hour or so to get a table at Retro Ray's. Would've been faster, but the 8 top there before us was slow in leaving even after paying. Finally, the bartender picked up their napkins and they all split. "Works every time," he said.

Huh. Never thought of that!

We started with a bottle of the Ball Buster ($34), switched to the Radio Boca ($18), then had one bottle of Wine Guerrilla ($28) before going back to the Radio Boca. After all, we'd had a couple of beers at 4 Courts before. $18 for a bottle of wine? RIDICULOUS(-ly cheap).

Two devilishly good eggs, one crab bisque, six steaks, one order of the mushrooms (GET THESE THEY ARE FANTASTIC), and a madeira later, we're out the door having had a great time (even just hanging out at the bar, and KUDOS to the bartender who quickly hooked me up with club soda when a certain member of our group splashed my Guerrilla all over my new sweater) and off for my hijinks and the getting the married guys in trouble for being out too late...

(Big props to all the staff there last night - really, the service was impeccable and friendly. It's always nice to be able to relax and not worry, unlike some other places we hit that night...)

[BookGuy]

I was at The Third on Friday night and was somewhat diappointed. I had a platter with both chicken and shrimp and, although they were OK, I should have stuck to one of the steaks that I really love. One of my companions had the steak and cheese sandwich which he really liked. The best thing I ate was the cole slaw. Since this Ray's is walkable from where I live in beautiful downtown Rosslyn, I will be back for the steak.

[DaRiv18]

Yes! We ended up dining there last week impromptu. The menu was still limited (no dessert at the time, but there were plans to do so), and a full bar. I actually didn't see much difference in the menu pre-closing as I thought I would. Also, there seemed to be a lack of sides...mashed potatoes at East River please! As I've said before, this is a great option for those of us in Capitol Hill and surrounding environs to enjoy a Ray's steak, but don't expect the full Ray's experience.

I think you are being too kind. Tonight was the last time I'll visit East River barring compelling reasons otherwise.

Now, obviously, you're still going to get your moneys worth at East River, if you compare to the average restaurant. But upthread, I read about so many exciting things going on in the other locations. But when I visit the reopened East River, it clearly has regressed from where it started (ie, the menu is not very adventurous or sophisticated comparatively), as pidgey basically illustrates. No steak frites, very few cuts to choose from, no dry-aging or deviled eggs or bone marrow or milkshakes. Again, I am disappointed with the available variety and depth, not the quality of items offered.

Heading over to a Ray's in Arlington is not that much more of a production for our family on H Street. The disparity between East River and Arlington has become too pronounced to justify future DC visits, for now.

[rbh]

We were at the 3rd yesterday.... sad to report that the Brazilian cut is now off the menu... according to our friendly waiter, it's been gone for over a week now.

[Michael Landrum]

I think you are being too kind. Tonight was the last time I'll visit East River barring compelling reasons otherwise.

Now, obviously, you're still going to get your moneys worth at East River, if you compare to the average restaurant. But upthread, I read about so many exciting things going on in the other locations. But when I visit the reopened East River, it clearly has regressed from where it started (ie, the menu is not very adventurous or sophisticated comparatively), as pidgey basically illustrates. No steak frites, very few cuts to choose from, no dry-aging or deviled eggs or bone marrow or milkshakes. Again, I am disappointed with the available variety and depth, not the quality of items offered.

Heading over to a Ray's in Arlington is not that much more of a production for our family on H Street. The disparity between East River and Arlington has become too pronounced to justify future DC visits, for now.

Thank you for the opportunity for me to remind readers that we are no longer, repeat, no longer offering free limo service to the Kennedy Center from the Dix Street location. Limo service to the House on Georgia Avenue, with complimentary passes to the Pit, is still available.

[Michael Landrum]

We were at the 3rd yesterday.... sad to report that the Brazilian cut is now off the menu... according to our friendly waiter, it's been gone for over a week now.

So far, we have served on average 1500 diners each week at Ray's to the Third, at a check average of $21 per guest (including beverage). Of those 1500 diners each week, 500 choose to order a steak. Of those 500 diners who choose to order a steak each week, on average 20 diners per week--just under 3 per day--choose (chose) the Brazilian.

Meanwhile, at Ray's The Steaks and at Retro Ray's, we may run out of the Brazilian by 8:30 on any given night. So, as with all things Ray's, we invest and direct our resources to where, and how, we can disappoint the fewest.

Should any one desire their steak frites to be served with the Brazilian cut, or any cut for that matter, simply call ahead and your requested cut will be waiting (provided, that is, we can tell our restaurants apart enough to find the right one).

Beginning tomorrow, if Ray's to the Third is the one I'm thinking of, and not one of the others that even I can't tell apart, and my GPS sends me to the right place, there will be a new cut or two on the menu.

But no new beers. (In today's mythology, Sisyphus would be a craft beer drinker who each day after extolling his latest find to the very peak of exquisite and exclusive taste, wakes to find yesterday's elixir discovered by the dreaded masses and therefore rendered deplorable, only to inexorably begin his arduous task of anointment anew).

I hope that what you did have was satisfactory for the price and that you were treated civilly, if not well.

[mdt]

I think you are being too kind. Tonight was the last time I'll visit East River barring compelling reasons otherwise.

Now, obviously, you're still going to get your moneys worth at East River, if you compare to the average restaurant. But upthread, I read about so many exciting things going on in the other locations. But when I visit the reopened East River, it clearly has regressed from where it started (ie, the menu is not very adventurous or sophisticated comparatively), as pidgey basically illustrates. No steak frites, very few cuts to choose from, no dry-aging or deviled eggs or bone marrow or milkshakes. Again, I am disappointed with the available variety and depth, not the quality of items offered.

Heading over to a Ray's in Arlington is not that much more of a production for our family on H Street. The disparity between East River and Arlington has become too pronounced to justify future DC visits, for now.

So are you saying that the menu at the restaurant (which according to the web site may change) is different than the one posted? Are you going to complain if RtS does not have the DC skillet fried chicken? I don't believe that each place is supposed to be exactly like the other. Each has its own personality so enjoy them (or not) for what they are.

[DaRiv18]

I wasn't really saying that at all, but as it happens it is very different than what you posted. The prices seem higher than what you linked to (I'm pretty sure the Kansas City Strip is closer to $25 than $18).

I don't think each place is supposed to be exactly like the other, either. But East River is nowhere close to what the others provide. I see that you did not post the beer and wine list, it is a totally different animal than what you'd find in Arlington.

You mention personality mdt. How would you describe East Rivers personality?

For me, the personality is now much more non-descript after the renovation. The biggest change is that all the comfortable booths have been removed and there's more conventional tables and chairs to increase their capacity. So, excuse me if I observe a decline in the personality of the restaurant. I seem to recall they used to offer kid meals, that is definitely no longer available (maybe my memory is wrong though. No mac and cheese here anymore). They do offer double patty burgers, I guess that demonstrates personality. Also, there is now a TV at the bar.

But hey, they gave it a good go the first time around and I guess the diners didn't support certain dishes. Gone is the smoked prime rib, which was excellent, probably for same reasons the Brazilian is no longer at Ray's the Third. I don't fault East River for changing to accommodate demand, or moving towards a more volume driven restaurant. Mr. Landrum is obviously a committed proprietor, and maybe I'm criticizing the East River clientele more than operations. I supported the restaurant in the past, I thought it had a chance to close the gap with the other Rays, but now the gulf is widening, IMO. YMMV, but actually I think I'm being pretty factual about this.

[Michael Landrum]

I wasn't really saying that at all, but as it happens it is very different than what you posted. The prices seem higher than what you linked to (I'm pretty sure the Kansas City Strip is closer to $25 than $18.

I don't think each place is supposed to be exactly like the other, either. But East River is nowhere close to what the others provide. I see that you did not post the beer and wine list, it is a totally different animal than what you'd find in Arlington.

You mention personality mdt. How would you describe East Rivers personality?

For me, the personality is now much more non-descript after the renovation. The biggest change is that all the comfortable booths have been removed and there's more conventional tables and chairs to increase their capacity. So, excuse me if I observe a decline in the personality of the restaurant. I seem to recall they used to offer kid meals, that is definitely no longer available (maybe my memory is wrong though. No mac and cheese here anymore). They do offer double patty burgers, I guess that demonstrates personality. Also, there is now a TV at the bar.

But hey, they gave it a good go the first time around and I guess the diners didn't support certain dishes. Gone is the smoked prime rib, which was excellent, probably for same reasons the Brazilian is no longer at Ray's the Third. I don't fault East River for changing to accommodate demand, or moving towards a more volume driven restaurant. Mr. Landrum is obviously a committed proprietor, and maybe I'm criticizing the East River clientele more than operations. I supported the restaurant in the past, I thought it had a chance to close the gap with the other Rays, but now the gulf is widening, IMO. YMMV, but actually I think I'm being pretty factual about this.

Factual, accurate, perceptive and insightful.

I would argue, however, that durability and accessibility, not volume, were the motivating factors in the floor plan adaptations. (Well, that and the fact that East River and Ray's to the Third are essentially nearly identical--by design--save for the numeric quantity of menu variations beyond the core offerings). Other than that, your observations are pretty spot on.

However, as the East River team grows in skills and confidence, the menu and other offerings will continue to evolve and grow.

Many of the gaps that in 2008 I dearly believed would narrow, even disappear--changes in which I had hoped to play even the smallest of roles as catalyst--have since widened into not just unbreachable gulfs, but into unfathomable chasms.

I am surprised, in any case, that East River even matters on this board enough to be discussed. The clear signal has always been that it does not.

[DanCole42]

So how are the frites?

[DanielK]

I go to Silver Spring RTC for the weeknight Bistro special. What's better than a hanger steak?

I go to Arlington RTS for the full-on steak experience, usually a dry-aged cut, and Mr. Slater to pick something to match from the wine list.

I rarely make it to R^3 or Hell Burger, because it's quite a drive from MoCo for those, but I have been there on occasion.

But the location I visit most often is East River. Because there are 20 home DC United games in a season, and it's <2 miles away. The staff there has never been anything but friendly, and it doesn't matter that it's not the RTS/RTC experience. It's the East River experience, and I'm fine with that. I never expected it to mirror the other locations, so I'm not disappointed that it doesn't. Burgers are excellent here. I've enjoyed the smoked prime rib, but the t-bone and KC Strip steaks are excellent.

March 10 is opening night for DC United. I probably won't see you there, Michael, but I'll be there at about 6p, enjoying whatever East River is now.

[rbh]

So far, we have served on average 1500 diners each week at Ray's to the Third, at a check average of $21 per guest (including beverage). Of those 1500 diners each week, 500 choose to order a steak. Of those 500 diners who choose to order a steak each week, on average 20 diners per week--just under 3 per day--choose (chose) the Brazilian.

Meanwhile, at Ray's The Steaks and at Retro Ray's, we may run out of the Brazilian by 8:30 on any given night. So, as with all things Ray's, we invest and direct our resources to where, and how, we can disappoint the fewest.

Should any one desire their steak frites to be served with the Brazilian cut, or any cut for that matter, simply call ahead and your requested cut will be waiting (provided, that is, we can tell our restaurants apart enough to find the right one).

Beginning tomorrow, if Ray's to the Third is the one I'm thinking of, and not one of the others that even I can't tell apart, and my GPS sends me to the right place, there will be a new cut or two on the menu.

But no new beers. (In today's mythology, Sisyphus would be a craft beer drinker who each day after extolling his latest find to the very peak of exquisite and exclusive taste, wakes to find yesterday's elixir discovered by the dreaded masses and therefore rendered deplorable, only to inexorably begin his arduous task of anointment anew).

I hope that what you did have was satisfactory for the price and that you were treated civilly, if not well.

Thanks for the info Michael. We've always gotten great meals at RTS and now R^3. Now that we have an infant, we've found R^3 more casual atmosphere a better choice for us... plus it has a few more non-steak options for my non-beef eating wife (p.s. thanks for having the salmon diablo at all the steak establishments!)

[DaRiv18]

But the location I visit most often is East River. Because there are 20 home DC United games in a season, and it's <2 miles away.

I do think it is still an important and good neighborhood restaurant. I no longer think it's a destination restaurant, unlike most of the rest of the Ray's (I've only been to Hell Burger and RTS Arlington). You're not saying whether you would still go if the United ever get a new stadium that's not nearby, so perhaps you agree with me. It's positive that East River is adapting to better suit its neighborhood, and like all things relating to class and/or race, it is unrealistic to expect straight-line improvement without setbacks. And I'm probably be back, despite my online tizzy here; I was just majorly disppointed with the change in direction. Hopefully the regulars there are happier with the adjustments.

Maybe all of us Rockwellians can rent a limo and head there for a special group dinner there one night. If not us, then who? Hamburger Yelpers?

[SeanMike]

Beginning tomorrow, if Ray's to the Third is the one I'm thinking of, and not one of the others that even I can't tell apart, and my GPS sends me to the right place, there will be a new cut or two on the menu.

Good thing I'm not in my office, because I definitely busted up laughing at this line.

(Salmon diablo? I never even looked past the steaks on the menu! Now I have to go again! OH NOES THE INSANITY)

[DanCole42]

Finally made it to Ray's^3 for lunch. The steak and cheese... oh man, like Michael said it's definitely not a "philly cheeseteak" but it IS an amazing sandwich. It's basically a bunch of sweet and delicious beef char held together with creamy provolone. Even the bread works great with it.

Fries were not bad. Get some picanha sauce to go with them.

[levjn]

As someone who lives in Clarendon, we're fortunate enough to be pretty much within walking distance to the bulk of the "Ray's Empire"! That said, we're certainly regulars - particularly of the original RTS and now the Bistro (and find ourselves most often opting for a Rays when dining out for a guaranteed great meal regardless of what new or trending restaurant is doing up the street). We love the concept of Rays^3 and have been several times - however the thing that keeps us from choosing Rays^3 over the others (even if it means longer wait times for a table) is mostly the lack of a "healthy-ish" vegetable side dish. Minor thing, yes, but it'd make a big difference for us. The double salad option with your steak or seafood is a nice option, but not as much variety as say the option for a steamed broccoli crown (like RTS/Bistro) or some other green veg... perhaps even some spinach/other greens saute or a green bean side? I'd even be willing to pay the up-charge for this over the fries. Nothing fancy - but just as an option for those of us who adore the fries, mac and cheese, onion "fries" (yum!) etc. yet can't indulge in those as often as we'd like - but of course always leave room for the indulgence of the great steaks/seafood entrees! So, Michael, have you ever or would you consider adding something like this? Pretty please?

[Michael Landrum]

Comments in response to the recent Post article on dining options in Wards 7 and 8:

FishBulb

2/19/2012 11:21 PM EST

Hasn't Ray's been "closed for renovations" for months?

NewEra

2:58 AM EST

I doubt Ray's will ever reopen. Too bad. Ample parking, good food and moderate prices. Guess the profit margin wasn't large enough.

MichaelLandrum

5:07 AM EST

Actually, Ray's The Steaks at East River has been open now for several weeks, according to plan and ahead of schedule, a fact that was not reported by the Post.

The impression that we would not be re-opening, which several of the posters below accepted as fact, was merely the result of deliberately misleading insinuations by another Post reporter, Tim Carman, an error in judgement and professionalism which apparently he could not be bothered to correct.

One that also, wrongly and unfairly, adversely impacted the reputation of the neighborhood in an attempt to damage mine.

We are proud and to serve Wards 7 and 8 for a long time to come, and to welcome back all of our neighbors and friends.

--Michael Landrum

It would be interesting to share the e-mail exchange I shared with Mr. Schwartzman as to why I declined to comment for his article, but parts of that would be too hurtful to some, even by my standards.

[Lydia R]

Comments in response to the recent Post article on dining options in Wards 7 and 8:

<snip>

We are proud and to serve Wards 7 and 8 for a long time to come, and to welcome back all of our neighbors and friends.

--Michael Landrum

It's an early President's Day holiday and I've just caught Paul Schwartzman's piece in WaPo.

Are the comments section following WaPo articles moderated by WaPo staff? It would help.

Here's the graphic accompanying the article based on D.C. assessment data. Credit to Magda Jean-Louis, Dan Keating and Laris Karklis.

[Michael Landrum]

Minor thing, yes, but it'd make a big difference for us. The double salad option with your steak or seafood is a nice option, but not as much variety as say the option for a steamed broccoli crown (like RTS/Bistro) or some other green veg... perhaps even some spinach/other greens saute or a green bean side? I'd even be willing to pay the up-charge for this over the fries. Nothing fancy - but just as an option for those of us who adore the fries, mac and cheese, onion "fries" (yum!) etc. yet can't indulge in those as often as we'd like - but of course always leave room for the indulgence of the great steaks/seafood entrees! So, Michael, have you ever or would you consider adding something like this? Pretty please?

Done.

[levjn]

Done.

Yippee!! Thanks Michael - you just made my week - and I've had a pretty fantastic week! We'll definitely be in soon to check it out - if not this weekend!

We went to Retro Rays the other night and everything, as usual, was top notch. Our waiter was a real class act too! Got a chance to briefly chat with Mark and he recommended a bottle of the Ball Buster which was excellent. Then we each had the heart of the ribeye which was really good - I'd never noticed this cut before (I'm boring and almost always get the hanger) - but the highlight was the pairing with the porcini puree option - that puree is now going to be a new habit! My favorite cut, when available, is still the ribeye's "top cap" - the Calotte... which they didn't have at "Retro" the other night - but I.have had before at the Third and RTS.

All in all - a wonderful meal and even when you feel like you're going all out and splurging (3 courses + wine - lots of wine!) - you still don't break the bank! Thanks again for providing such a dependably great experience! See you again soon!

[genericeric]

I'm going to preface this by saying, Don - if this is in the wrong thread, please move as you see fit. This does heavily involve RTS.

I've noticed recently this site diverging between food and restaurants - both are valid topics. Specific examples include Xavier's restaurants in Eastern Market, Isabella and his baby empire, and Rays the Steaks in all of its iterations.

Food and its preparation is obviously central to any discussion regarding restaurants - but its not the only factor. Restaurants exist as a business, and include ambience, service, food, and yes, the opportunity for the proprietor (or in this case the improprietor) the opportunity to earn a living.

Concentrating on Rays for a moment as I believe it's the most pure example... Every member of this board is entitled to their opinions (Don included, re: recent Isabella/Spike post). But recent much has been made of Rays and changes both in Arlington and East River.

Rays has both been criticized for a homogenization of Arlington/Silver Spring restaurants, while also being criticized for a divergence from this 'formula' at its East River location... I ate at RS3 tonight for the first time in awhile, and yes, it has certainly lost much of its independence from other Ray's restaurants since its opening. But you know what? I liked this version better, and I'm willing to bet my dinner that is why ML made the adjustments.

Stepping back for a second, when I was a 23 yr old staffer on Capital Hill, my favorite restaurant was the Greek Taverna. Why? Because it wasn't filled with drunken staffers after hours. I could always find a seat. It was quiet. It was just me and Dennis Kucinich on more nights than I can count. I was furious with Spike when he bought the Taverna and changed it. But then I realized that the very reasons why I liked the GK were the very reasons why it closed - it was desolate on a Wednesday night while Cap Lounge and Hawk and Dove were busy. I'm sure the owners of GK appreciated that I enjoyed their restaurant, but they would have enjoyed the profits that would have enabled them to stay open more.

Back to Rays - I don't know Michael Landrum. I've never met him, and don't know his motivations. Frankly, I didn't even have that great of an experience at his restaurant tonight. But he's a restaurant owner who cares deeply about his restaurants, his employees, and many of his customers - that I can tell.

I invite him to disagree/correct me, but it seems evident what is happening. Michael Landrum has found a formula that works. Great food, great wine, good service, affordable prices. But how that formula plays out in Arlington is different from how that formula plays out in East River. East River customers want the same thing - good food at reasonable prices with service that respects the restaurant's customers. So after being open for a period of time, ML took a look at the business and cut what wasn't selling and added what was. That isn't a dumbing down of his business, its making sure the business aligns with the needs of the customer. I guarantee you I can still find an amazing glass of red wine at East River, but maybe the market doesn't support offering 5 by the glass. That's not dumbing down, that's being responsive to your customers. And when he changed the RS3 menu, I would guess a certain number of guests balked at eating red meat and fries in the same meal so he altered to be a more traditional menu in order to better meet the needs of his customers.

Many local restauranteurs aren't trying to be a great chef, they're trying to open a certain type of restaurant that appeals to those who want an evening out more than a great meal. And they're making money. There is valid criticism of those approaches, especially if you live/work in those neighborhoods and/or working in those kitchens. And Michael Landrum is trying to tailor his restaurants so that a VERY wide range of customers (Silver Spring, Arlington, East River) are happy in a way that allows him to maintain his business. After all of his charitable acts, he isn't running a charity. He's running restaurants, and making a living doing it.

[DaRiv18]

Michael Landrum has found a formula that works. Great food, great wine, good service, affordable prices. But how that formula plays out in Arlington is different from how that formula plays out in East River. East River customers want the same thing - good food at reasonable prices with service that respects the restaurant's customers. So after being open for a period of time, ML took a look at the business and cut what wasn't selling and added what was. That isn't a dumbing down of his business, its making sure the business aligns with the needs of the customer. I guarantee you I can still find an amazing glass of red wine at East River, but maybe the market doesn't support offering 5 by the glass. That's not dumbing down, that's being responsive to your customers. And when he changed the RS3 menu, I would guess a certain number of guests balked at eating red meat and fries in the same meal so he altered to be a more traditional menu in order to better meet the needs of his customers.

I speak up because it's not clear to me that our sidebar in Watershed will ever be merged back here into this thread. genericeric, it's fair game to twice quote a word that I used. But you aren't acknowledging the paragraph that I immediately issued retracting that particular word. I'm all for sensationalism (duh!) but even I try to be fair, believe it or not.

Also, to guarantee that you can find an amazing glass of red wine at East River, well, wow. I get the sense the wine list is provided more as an amenity than it is presented as a program. Not that there's anything wrong with that. Are you guaranteeing this as someone who's been to East River, or are you guaranteeing this based on what you see at other Ray's?

We pay attention and rhapsodize about the various concept dining experiences that come and go in this city, but as genericeric points out, there's a difference between food and restaurants. Usually concept dining is about the food and the service. But what fascinates me is that East River was more of a concept restaurant in socio-economic terms. We're talking about an important restaurant that could someday rival Ben's Chili Bowl (in a positive way). I dined there often (not nearly as much as DanielK) and always enjoyed the service and the food. But especially the service, despite any technical hiccups -- everyone seemed so happy and hospitable. I don't think it's a secret that Anacostia has some of the worst unemployement rates in the city AND the country, so it was cool to be a diner supporting a micro-economy.

And I agree with darkstar965, Michael Landrum put his money where my mouth is. (I hope that doesn't get quoted out of context.) Alot of other people would have packed up camp and left, not to mention the big majority of entrepreneurs who would have never staked out that location to begin with.

I've just decided that I am going to do what the majority of the other people on this board do: go to one of the other Ray's instead. I'm still going to support the empire. I don't think Michael is a bad person, far from it. I'm just discussing what I think is an interesting social issue. I don't mean to offend Michael at all, he doesn't disagree with alot the substance of what I've written.

And to any future outspoken supporters who want to respond to this: I don't think he will lash out at my critique by coming to his senses and actually charging MARKET PRICES for the food and wine at his establishments. So no need to stroke his ego about what a great guy he is and how off-base I am. I mean merely to bring the spotlight on East River by saying how disappointed I am in it right now. Things change.

[genericeric]

DaRiv18, I didn't acknowledge the paragraph you're referring to because I wasn't writing that post specifically in response to you. There have been many comments on this board, in many threads, (this thread, those about Xavier's restaurants in SE/Barracks Row, the Mike Is A Bella thread, etc) recently that have focused exclusively on food at the expense of the financial health of the restaurant. That isn't necessarily a bad thing if this is a food board, but I do believe its important to remember that these restaurants are businesses - if nothing else as an explanation for why they evolve as they do - for better or worse. Yes, there have been comments recently specific to Rays - yours and others.

My intention was not to stroke anyone's ego - I, in fact, pointed out that my experience at Ray's last night wasn't that great. I was simply commenting on an issue that I've seen somewhat across the board on this site recently, and used Ray's as an example.

[Ilaine]

Finally made it to Ray's to the Third tonight -- must admit, I intended to go to Retro Ray's but for some reason today I could not brain.

I intended to be good and have the salmon but instead opted for maximum decadence, the filet with foie gras, porcini with truffles, and bordelaise. So good. Husband had the onglet with bone marrow. Son had onglet with frites. They wolfed it down. Husband very generously gave me half his marrow bone, which made mine even more decadent. I could only finish half, and took the rest home for tomorrow.

Also, first time trying the Devlishly Good Eggs, which husband called celestial, and I call a platonic dish.

All in all, a typically wonderful meal at Ray's which I would not even bother to mention except to complement our server, Jerome, who was perfect.

[weinoo]

There have been many comments on this board, in many threads, (this thread, those about Xavier's restaurants in SE/Barracks Row, the Mike Is A Bella thread, etc) recently that have focused exclusively on food at the expense of the financial health of the restaurant. That isn't necessarily a bad thing if this is a food board, but I do believe its important to remember that these restaurants are businesses - if nothing else as an explanation for why they evolve as they do - for better or worse. Yes, there have been comments recently specific to Rays - yours and others.

So are you saying that people who go out to eat and post about restaurants on food boards shouldn't write about the food? Or the service? Or the wine list?

I mean, if I go to a flower shop, and I get shitty flowers, and I decide to post about that on a community bulletin board where people post about businesses in the community, should I not mention the flowers?

[zoramargolis]

Finally made it to Ray's to the Third tonight -- must admit, I intended to go to Retro Ray's but for some reason today I could not brain.

Just FYI, Retro Ray's is closed on Mondays. We tried to go on a recent Monday, and ended up at Ray's^3 when we found out it was closed. The second time we tried to go to Retro Ray's, the roads were closed for the Mardi Gras parade.

[DonRocks]

Just FYI, Retro Ray's is closed on Mondays. We tried to go on a recent Monday, and ended up at Ray's^3 when we found out it was closed. The second time we tried to go to Retro Ray's, the roads were closed for the Mardi Gras parade.

Michael, if you could PM me updated information for the Ray's: The Basics thread, I'll update everything, and link to it prominently. (Or maybe your website is up to date now? Just let me know, please.)

[Heather]

So are you saying that people who go out to eat and post about restaurants on food boards shouldn't write about the food? Or the service? Or the wine list?

I think your straw man is on fire. I think what Mr. Generic was trying to say is that despite our desire here at donrockwell.com for purity of intent, food is not the only component retauranteurs take into consideration when setting their menus, prices, hours, decor, etc. How often are those taken into consideration on the board when, say, 2941 gets a beat-down for repositioning themselves in a tough market? Maybe this action will allow them to survive until things are better, unlike some other recently closed suburban NoVa restaurants?

[genericeric]

I think your straw man is on fire. I think what Mr. Generic was trying to say is that despite our desire here at donrockwell.com for purity of intent, food is not the only component retauranteurs take into consideration when setting their menus, prices, hours, decor, etc. How often are those taken into consideration on the board when, say, 2941 gets a beat-down for repositioning themselves in a tough market? Maybe this action will allow them to survive until things are better, unlike some other recently closed suburban NoVa restaurants?

That's exactly what I was trying to say

[weinoo]

I think your straw man is on fire. I think what Mr. Generic was trying to say is that despite our desire here at donrockwell.com for purity of intent, food is not the only component retauranteurs take into consideration when setting their menus, prices, hours, decor, etc. How often are those taken into consideration on the board when, say, 2941 gets a beat-down for repositioning themselves in a tough market? Maybe this action will allow them to survive until things are better, unlike some other recently closed suburban NoVa restaurants?

That's all well and good. But is it my job as a customer to worry about a restaurant's business plan? There are restaurants I go to on a near-weekly basis, not because I Iike or worry about their business plan, but because I enjoy the atmosphere, enjoy the food and enjoy the service - that's why I go out to dine.

[darkstar965]

That's all well and good. But is it my job as a customer to worry about a restaurant's business plan? There are restaurants I go to on a near-weekly basis, not because I Iike or worry about their business plan, but because I enjoy the atmosphere, enjoy the food and enjoy the service - that's why I go out to dine.

Sure, but that's what segmentation is about. As with any business, different restaurants appeal to different types of customers. Knowing the intended market and then meeting that market's needs is key to success. Don't have to worry about anyone's b-plan. Just go to the spots you like and avoid the ones you don't. As for the business stuff or food stuff, my understanding is that it's all welcome here so long as food or restaurant related. Just like the restaurants, some boards/forums/threads will appeal more than others. Personally, I like that we tend to talk about restaurants holistically.

[New Foodie]

So, I'm not sure if I'm supposed to write a Ray's to the Third review on here or another thread (if this is the wrong place, please feel free to move it!).

Met two friends at "3" last night and the place was very quiet (maybe 4-5 tables seated and it's a decent-sized space). The service was a bit spotty, but we all enjoyed our food, and of course the prices. Knowing I can get some similar things to original Ray's but with no wait or crowding is definitely a good thing.

First thing to note is that the menu online is not really so much accurate. I was a bit disappointed since I had heard so much early on about the catfish to find that it is no longer on the menu (despite being listed online). The menu now consists of some "Gusher" burger options, the infamous steak and cheese, fried chicken, a few apps (bisque, salad, fried shrimp, devilishly good eggs, etc), the roasted veggie plate, then a bunch of steaks. While the steaks listed on the current online menu are similar to the current in-restaurant menu, the pairings have also changed. The Hanger and Top Sirloin "Parisien" come with frites and a salad (or onion fries/half and half for $1 more), and the rest of the steaks are served with mashed potatoes and steamed broccoli. All steaks also come with bread (which last night was a really awesome, if somewhat oily, olive oil and rosemary flatbread).

The vegetarian in the group was thankfully placated with the Portobello Mushroom Caps (Marinated and Grilled with Fresh Eggplant, Grilled Onions and Topped with Smoked Mozzarella, Served with Mac-n-Cheese and Salad), although there was no cheese found anywhere on the plate. One friend had the Filet Mignon (Served with Béarnaise) and didn't leave much on her plate, so I think she enjoyed it. She was also pleased with the $22 price tag for a filet and generous sides.

I went with the Hanger (Onglet) (Our Richest, Most Intensely Flavored(But Not Most Tender)Steak with Béarnaise) for $17, but switched up a couple of things. I got half and half instead of just fries, and opted for blue cheese crumbles instead of the Bearnaise (which ended up being a $1 up charge I was not told about). I also asked about getting the bisque instead of a salad (since they were the same price on the menu) and was told that wasn't doable, but they did offer mac and cheese as a swap (again for an unquoted up charge of $1). All in all it was a large amount of food (half of which I have for lunch today) and quite delicious for a measly $20, but it would have been nice to know that my switches came at a cost as I was ordering them. The fries were thin and crispy and the onion straws reminded me, in a good way, of the onion pieces pulled from an Outback bloomin' onion. The mac and cheese was good, but very rich and nothing out of the ordinary.

We were too full to indulge in a milkshake, but did enjoy the peanut butter fudge that came with the check. I look forward to heading back to try the steak and cheese at some point! That's been on my to-do list for a while...