ABC Closures

[jparrott]

we arrived at 2 amys to find third graders reading their parents the yellow advisory on the front door and window warning diners that the establishment had lost its liquor license for two days

I'm sorry, but this is a national emergency. Summon the national guard and activate the EAS. Brennan Downey will be prepared to speak in ten minutes.

[DonRocks]

we arrived at 2 amys to find third graders reading their parents the yellow advisory on the front door and window warning diners that the establishment had lost its liquor license for two days, which wasn't enough to discourage a small mob from forming on the sidewalk waiting for a table.

without knowing exactly the reason for the punishment, i can only assume that some too-young-to-drive-anyway birthday party celebrants got out of hand after drinking too much gragnano.

The same thing happened to Bistrot du Coin, who got (so I was told) busted last Spring. They could pick any two days they wanted to shut down, and they chose two days this week. I suppose they figured this was the slowest week of the year.

Cheers,

Rocks.

[jpschust]

This just happened to the Angry Inch in Adams Morgan. Frankly- I wish ABC could extend this.

[LittleWing]

the same thing happened to asia nora (yes rocks, the Starr got busted). I think at Viridian too? ABC went nuts with it back in the summer - going to a bunch of restaurants that you would never usually think of as being at the top of the list of the places selling alcohol to underage kids.

[legant]

Is there a published list of ABC closures? At one point the WaPo would list health code violations with close/open dates. Is there something similar for ABC actions?

ABC went nuts with it back in the summer - going to a bunch of restaurants that you would never usually think of as being at the top of the list of the places selling alcohol to underage kids.

[qwertyy]

Is there a published list of ABC closures? At one point the WaPo would list health code violations with close/open dates. Is there something similar for ABC actions?

The ABC helpfully lists all suspended and revoked licenses here, but hasn't updated it for two years.

Ah, DC government...

[Robert Rymarz]

I certainly wish I was aware of this thread this morning as a long heated discussion regarding the same topic was taking place on egullet.

In short it regarded a underage young man who was refused wine service at a very well known high end restaurant. Which some felt showed the sign of a inexperienced server who should have realized this law is not enforced in NYC. Some went as far as believing gratuity should have been withheld.

My opinion on the matter is I seen no harm in the young man having a glass of wine with his family but on the other hand to punish the server for obeying the law regardless of the city it's in is beyond ridiculous.

[giant shrimp]

during my one and only summer working in the restaurant industry, a perky waitress solved the problem of a parent sharing their bottle of wine with an obviously underage child by rushing up to the table with a water pitcher and flooding the glass. while this innovative approach would probably require more manpower than the abc is willing to expend, i find it far preferable to hustling unnaturally mature looking underaged employees to hook duped or distracted bartenders and servers. judging from the number of times i have seen 80-year-old women who can barely stand ordered to produce their identity cards on the bus to quality for a reduced fare, the metro drivers must be instructed that there is an inordinate number of ex-abc workers riding public transportation around town. "can you believe it, dear, i'm just like the portrait of dorian gray, only the opposite."

[LittleWing]

In short it regarded a underage young man who was refused wine service at a very well known high end restaurant. Which some felt showed the sign of a inexperienced server who should have realized this law is not enforced in NYC. Some went as far as believing gratuity should have been withheld.

My opinion on the matter is I seen no harm in the young man having a glass of wine with his family but on the other hand to punish the server for obeying the law regardless of the city it's in is beyond ridiculous.

wait, what law isn't enforced? underage drinking? or do they not have undercover people going around trying to bust bartenders and servers? or that kids can drink when their parents are around?

i find it far preferable to hustling unnaturally mature looking underaged employees to hook duped or distracted bartenders and servers.

when my SO was busted, one couple purposely knocked a full glass of water over all over the bar while the undercover couple ordered the beer. Oh yeah, and it was during Restaurant week. Fair, isn't it?

Ok, I realize my bitterness must end soon....

[Jacques Gastreaux]

I certainly wish I was aware of this thread this morning as a long heated discussion regarding the same topic was taking place on egullet.

In short it regarded a underage young man who was refused wine service at a very well known high end restaurant. Which some felt showed the sign of a inexperienced server who should have realized this law is not enforced in NYC. Some went as far as believing gratuity should have been withheld.

My opinion on the matter is I seen no harm in the young man having a glass of wine with his family but on the other hand to punish the server for obeying the law regardless of the city it's in is beyond ridiculous.

Serving alcohol to an underage customer places the livelihood of the restaurnat, and its employees at risk. I don't understand the mindset that would punish a server by withholding a tip for refusing to serve a clearly underage customer. In DC, the restaurant loses its right to serve alcohol for a couple of days. In VA, the consequences can be much more catastrophic.

[Robert Rymarz]

Serving alcohol to an underage customer places the livelihood of the restaurnat, and its employees at risk. I don't understand the mindset that would punish a server by withholding a tip for refusing to serve a clearly underage customer. In DC, the restaurant loses its right to serve alcohol for a couple of days. In VA, the consequences can be much more catastrophic.

I completely agree and after I and others repeatedly tried to stress that point a few responded that this is overlooked in NYC and we failed to understand that.

[qwertyy]

Serving alcohol to an underage customer places the livelihood of the restaurnat, and its employees at risk. I don't understand the mindset that would punish a server by withholding a tip for refusing to serve a clearly underage customer. In DC, the restaurant loses its right to serve alcohol for a couple of days. In VA, the consequences can be much more catastrophic.

And, in fact, I've asked after this. I usually leave my license at home when I travel, so on returning, I seemed to inevitably forget to drop it back into my wallet and walk into my favorite joints without any ID whatsoever. Turns out that even though my regular bartenders have seen my ID before, even though they know me well, even though they know I'm 31, they could still get pinched if I don't have the damn card on me. So as annoying as it may be to get carded for smokes ("do you really think I'm 17??") or for booze, since learning this I decided that I shall never complain, nor shall I ever leave my apartment without my ID again. It's just polite.

[blakegwinn]

I certainly wish I was aware of this thread this morning as a long heated discussion regarding the same topic was taking place on egullet.

In short it regarded a underage young man who was refused wine service at a very well known high end restaurant. Which some felt showed the sign of a inexperienced server who should have realized this law is not enforced in NYC. Some went as far as believing gratuity should have been withheld.

My opinion on the matter is I seen no harm in the young man having a glass of wine with his family but on the other hand to punish the server for obeying the law regardless of the city it's in is beyond ridiculous.

Fine, don't give me a freaking tip, still don't care. Somebody being upset with me and 20-30 bucks is STILL not worth getting busted. I still don't see why people get mad at me. If it really pisses you off that badly write to your city councilman. It does suck when someone I have ID'd before comes in and I ask and they don't have it but undercover people are out there. It isn't just paranoia, made obvious by the blitzkrieg in the late summer this year. And you would be crazy to think they wouldn't bust you if they overheard this conversation from another table. We get to look at our secret shopper reports when they come in (in-house not government) and some of the questions asked on there are about the people around. "Did the bartender appear to give anyone something for free" "Did they appear to be asking others for id" type questions. I know it isn't fair and he is your son and you PROMISE he is 21, but it is the law. I have NOTHING to do with it. It is like the speeding ticket thing. I am the first to shout obsecenities when I get nailed in a speed trap. Yeah it sucks that the speed limit is 25 on a 6 lane road going down a hill and it is 3 in the morning and the road is completlely empty but it is the law. If I want to break that law and speed (or in this case serve your kid) I have to be willing to accept the consequences of getting nailed.

[The Hersch]

May I just interject that the drinking age is very stupid? Set the drinking age at 16 and the driving age at 25 and everyone would be happier and lead better lives.

[TedE]

May I just interject that the drinking age is very stupid? Set the drinking age at 16 and the driving age at 25 and everyone would be happier and lead better lives.

Everyone except the parents chauffeuring their drunk high schoolers about town ...

Everyone needs to take responsibility for their part in this footnote to the social contract. Don't whine like a grade school kid if you get denied for not having your ID on you. Personal responsibility does not extend beyond your person, a line of thinking that seems to have been thrown out of the window recently. You wouldn't complain to the Metro attendants if you left your MetroCard at home and had to stand behind the tourist hordes to get your paper ticket, would you? Well of course not, you would just walk past the sleeping guard through that little side gate, but the point stands.

This can be very serious business depending on the jurisdiction. I couldn't find the cite online, but in the mid/late 90s when I was working in DE a bartender was facing potential jail time because he overserved (strike 1) an underage person (strike 2) who then went on to kill somebody with his car. It was a busy night, he had met other friends who had been previously carded, was being slipped drinks under the table, etc. I believe there are some places in this country where a bartender can be responsible for serving someone who produces a reasonably good fake ID.

[crackers]

This can be very serious business depending on the jurisdiction. I couldn't find the cite online, but in the mid/late 90s when I was working in DE a bartender was facing potential jail time because he overserved (strike 1) an underage person (strike 2) who then went on to kill somebody with his car.

They're called "dram shop" laws. These laws, generally, create liability for bars, liquor stores, restaurants, social clubs and even private parties, if they sell alcohol to someone who is obviously intoxicated (or to a minor) who subsequently causes death or injury to a third-party as a result of an alcohol-related crash. IIRC, Delaware and Maryland don't have dram shop laws and DC doesn't have a specific dram shop statute, but it does have case law.