Whole Foods, an Austin-Based Store with Over 400 Locations in the U.S. and U.K. - Being Purchased by Amazon for $13.7 Billion

[jparrott]

This is the first Whole Foods in the country to be licensed as a restaurant rather than a retail gourmet food space.

And the ABC guys are going to be on your asses, like ten times harder than they were on the Best Cellars in Clarendon that tried to do this.

[Al Dente]

if all the wines are authentic

They are.

[jparrott]

They are.

How do you know? Even the most conscientious of agents has to be on the lookout. The fakers are gooooood. Real, real good.

I hate to touch the sourest subject in the ultra-fine-wine market, but there are scads of fakes out there. There's more 1945 Romanee-Conti on US wine lists than was ever produced. The bottles in that room came from a variety of sources, according to the store's wine manager, organized through New York state (where it is easier to pick up privately-held stock for resale) and a Virginia agent, to keep the VA ABC happy.

[Al Dente]

I must plead ignorance. I didn't realize that it's such a pervasive problem.

[Escoffier]

That's the area in the produce section with all the weird eggs (emu, duck, single-source organic, etc.). I remember some chat about it here when the Alexandria store opened.

we checked that out one time....I'm not sure there's a thriving market for emu eggs locally.

[Principia]

This is the first Whole Foods in the country to be licensed as a restaurant rather than a retail gourmet food space.

I'm anxious to hear what folks think!

I'm anxious to try it. Will this location stay open past 9:00 pm?

[Al Dente]

I'm anxious to try it. Will this location stay open past 9:00 pm?

Edited to add-- Hours: 8am - 9pm

More detailed info from the Whole Foods website...

[mame11]

Edited to add-- Hours: 8am - 9pm

More detailed info from the Whole Foods website...

I want to stop by before an event in Vienna tonight but mapquest is not recognizing the address... is it possible to combine with a trip to Vienna VA?

Thanks!

[Principia]

I want to stop by before an event in Vienna tonight but mapquest is not recognizing the address... is it possible to combine with a trip to Vienna VA?

Thanks!

They're not especially near one another. If you look up the Dick's Sporting Goods in Fair Lakes (12501 Fair Lakes Circle

Fairfax, VA 22033) and use that address, that should tell you whether it's feasible for you.

[Ilaine]

This is the first Whole Foods in the country to be licensed as a restaurant rather than a retail gourmet food space.

I'm anxious to hear what folks think!

Well, it does have several free-standing food areas, similar to food courts in shopping malls. Three are in the store (Asian/Japanese/sushi island seafood island, barbecue island, surrounded by counters and stools); one is to the side, Italian food, configured like a restaurant, and then there are a great deal of prepared foods, all of which can be consumed in an area with tables and chairs.

So, I would say that a significant proportion of the floor space is dedicated to the sale and consumption of prepared foods on the premises, aka restaurant.

Fairfax County isn't as picky about these definitions as MoCo. This particular store is a stone's throw from the Fairfax County government center aka Taj Mahal, and I would venture that one of their biggest customer bases will be county workers.

The entire store is huge, about the size of an aircraft hangar or a warehouse store. But otherwise a typical Whole Food store inside, only much bigger than usual. Hundreds, maybe thousands, of wine varieties. Hundreds of beer varieties. We noshed and grazed until almost full but I did try some of the sides at the barbecue bar. Deviled eggs pretty good, collard greens cooked with hot vinegar, which I would prefer to add myself, they were out of mac and cheese, and I wasn't in the mood for meat but my companion liked his beef BBQ.

If you like your local Whole Foods, you will love this one.

As an aside, I was one of the earliest members of the first Whole Food store, circa 1974, in New Orleans before they went on to bigger and better things. I think my membership number was 132. Looking at the company history I think this was the earliest establishment in what became Whole Foods.

Been a loyal customer for 32 years, and never had a bad experience, other than sticker shock.

[Free Wilma]

Do they have the gelato bar, like the WF in Austin? I still dream about that gelato.

[jparrott]

Do they have the gelato bar, like the WF in Austin? I still dream about that gelato.

Yes, including Sweet Corn and Ginger flavors.

[jparrott]

A couple of notes on dining at the Whole Foods:

1. No tipping allowed. Don't know why, but that's the straight dope.

2. If you order a glass of wine or a beer, you will be carded. I'm sure the VA ABC is just licking their chops at this place, ready to shut it down. Play along.

3. They did not do any soft openings, so the systems are sometimes a bit sketchy. Be patient and accomodating.

[DonRocks]

2. If you order a glass of wine or a beer, you will be carded.

I wasn't.

[ol_ironstomach]

we checked that out one time....I'm not sure there's a thriving market for emu eggs locally.

Hell, I'm still wondering if I can adequately fry one sunny-side up in a paella pan.

[jparrott]

Care to share any other thoughts about the joint, Don-o?

[ManekiNeko]

1. No tipping allowed. Don't know why, but that's the straight dope.

Perhaps they pay the servers a working (read: at least minimum) wage instead of the usual restaurant $2 and change?

[Joe H]

This is one of the largest Whole Foods in the Mid Atlantic at 65,000 square feet. It includes four sit down food bars (seafood and raw bar, sushi/Pan Asian/bbq and a fourth), a wine bar, a brick pizza oven, chocolatier and the largest buther shop, cheese shop, fishmonger, bakery and produce area that I have seen in any Whole Foods. The wine area is larger, too, probably about the size of Wegman's Dulles. At least three salad areas including a "world food bar" and a seafood salad bar among others. The emphasis is clearly on dining in as well as taking away. The overall ambience is similar to the Vienna store but probably at least 50% or more larger.

It is a worthy competitor to Wegmans and worth the trip to explore.

Whole Foods largest store is currently 85,000 square feet in Austin, TX where they are based. They are building a BIGGER one in Annapolis which will open next year.

Overall this feels very much like an European food market such as are found in Galeries Lafayette, Karstadt and other large department stores. This is going to put a huge dent into Safeway and Giant and will impact Wegmans to a degree.

[DonRocks]

Care to share any other thoughts about the joint, Don-o?

Stay tuned!

[jparrott]

Overall this feels very much like an European food market such as are found in Galeries Lafayette, Karstadt and other large department stores.

This is a very apt comparison. As soon as the staff work through the IS kinks and can focus on providing food and beverage service and expertise, this place will hum like a Harrod's food hall, etc.

An open question remains--can I buy a bottle of wine and then drink it at one of the food stations? VA law allows me to take home a portion of an opened bottle as well--will there be provision for this?

[Al Dente]

An open question remains--can I buy a bottle of wine and then drink it at one of the food stations? VA law allows me to take home a portion of an opened bottle as well--will there be provision for this?

I'll see what I can find out.

[Ilaine]

Some nice loss leaders: parmigiano reggiano $8.99/lb (regularly $13.99); Coleman NY strips $9.99/lb; Odwalla juices 50% regular price, bags of pre-washed organic salad greens $2.69, bags of pre-washed "conventional" salad greens $1.99, no doubt others I did not notice.

I think these prices will be in effect for a week (until Jan. 23).

[Anna Blume]

As a source for inspiration, this is not the best reproduction, but Piero's Brera Madonna depicts an egg suspended from the vaults of an architectural space as a symbol of rebirth or resurrection.

This was actually the fate of ostrich eggs in Western Europe where they were found above altars.

So, if you buy one, drain it carefully.

[Principia]

It is a worthy competitor to Wegmans and worth the trip to explore.

The +1 and I ventured there yesterday evening. I'm willing to chalk up some of the roughness in service to it being a brand-new store, but a few observations:

If they want to compete with Wegmans, closing several hours earlier in general and shutting down the prepared food "restaurants" an hour earlier isn't going to do it. I personally saw at least a dozen people being turned away - rather forcefully, as a matter of fact - from the various stations at 8 o'clock on the dot. And every one of those folks that I saw threw up their hands and left. And I'm pretty sure they were leaving the store entirely, based on the grumblings I was hearing. I can certainly appreciate that WF doesn't want to have people moseying up to the stations as they're trying to close the store, but unless people are wandering around the store reading the rather small signs at each station indicating they roll up at 8, people won't expect them to be closed that early. Since there's no WF in the immediate area, I'm pretty sure most people aren't expecting the store to close at 9 either.

Hint to the managers: if you want people out of your restaurants' hair as soon as possible after 8, make sure that your order-takers actually give the orders to the cooks and have them acknowledged, versus taking the last few orders down, chucking the pad vaguely in the direction of the cook's station, and then changing into one's civvies and running so quickly out the door that one would think the building was on fire... leaving the cooks to stare blankly at the people still waiting at the station for their orders. We waited almost 15 minutes and had to ask when our food was coming - and if we hadn't, neither us nor the woman who ordered right before us would've gotten our food.

The layout of the prepared foods areas, especially vis a vis the seating? Poor to the point of making me want to approach the store's designer, grab them by the shoulders, and ask them "What were you thinking?!" There is almost no seating at the stations themselves, and no real waiting area either... which means that anyone who can't get a seat at a station ends up unavoidably hovering over whomever is seated there. All of the other seating involves having to go through the store's main checkout line space to get to it. The largest section of seating is right across from the exit, which means that if it's cold out diners are subjected to howling arctic breezes about every minute and a half. Even better is that the entrance most people will probably come in from is the one that comes through the osteria. So anyone coming from that side has to try to enter the prepared-foods area of the store backwards through the express checkout area.

[jparrott]

It's pretty clear that the dining areas are going to go through three phases:

1. Getting a handle on their IS. The WF systems people are working all night, every night on this, according to the two bleary-eyed techies lunching around me at the seafood counter today.

2. Settling down into a meal-service mindset. Very few of the people working these counters have a lot of meal-service experience. Many of them affect an enthusiastic-neophyte nature right now.

3. Getting back to what they (presumably) do best, which is be experts on the food they are selling.

All that said, I had a lovely lunch today of cod with a provencal tomato-garlic relish, salad, and fries (which were decent, though clearly from not-starchy-enough varieties or not-hot-enough oil) for $12, and the better part of a half-bottle of the eminently passable and rich-flavor-friendly Gruet Blanc de Noirs sparkler from New Mexico for $8. Yum.

[mdt]

Pierre Luneau-Papin Muscadet "Terroir des Schistes" "Excelsior" 2002: From a cooperative program of tip-top Muscadet producers to explore monolithic single sites. This is ur-Muscadet, all rocks, stones and bones with rich white fruit and piercing, electrifying acidity. One for the long term. Imported by Jocelyn Cambier (and Joe Dressner in other states), $23 at Whole Foods.

Tasted this myself today and that is some damn fine wine. The guy in the tasting room told me that they are pouring it at the seafood bar too.

Thanks for the tip on the strip steaks as some of those made it into my cart as well.

And for all of you that have been there, how in the hell do you not mention that the meat counter has pork belly available?! You can get it raw, spiced, or smoked. Needless to say I picked up slightly over 2 lbs. Now to decide on what to do with it.

I asked about the suckling pigs and they are not the small ones. The guy did not know the exact weight, but they are not the small 10-15 pounders that I would like to roast. They are selling it smoked by the pound, although they said that you could order them raw. They have a huge smoker (using hickory) and have a bunch of items (don't remember what) for sale that have been smoked.

The whole fish selection looked very good and Kiren told me that they will keep these as a regularly stocked item. They can be cleaned anyway that you like for no additional charge. They had flounder, rockfish, black bass, red snapper, mackerel, and even whole monkfish, along with some others that I don't remember. Tomorrows dinner will center around whole red snapper.

If there are any orchid fans out there they have some nice ones for $10 (reg. $25).

I don't want to think about how crazy this place is going to be this weekend.

[jparrott]

Tasted this myself today and that is some damn fine wine. The guy in the tasting room told me that they are pouring it at the seafood bar too.

He was mistaken. The seafood bar is pouring the very decent Chasseloir Muscadet (which I believe is $10 retail).

[edenman]

And for all of you that have been there, how in the hell do you not mention that the meat counter has pork belly available?! You can get it raw, spiced, or smoked. Needless to say I picked up slightly over 2 lbs. Not to decide on what to do with it.

Make bacon? I have a friend at work who did this, and she had to special order the belly.

[mdt]

Make bacon? I have a friend at work who did this, and she had to special order the belly.

I am thinking pancetta for one portion and the other part will be braised.

[Principia]

And for all of you that have been there, how in the hell do you not mention that the meat counter has pork belly available?!

I was lucky to get my food and be done eating it by the time the store closed. We bought one piece of fish and that was it.

[JLK]

Today's Whole Foods food bar purchase: curried couscous. In a word (ok, two): extremely delicious.

I'm prone to food obsessions. Some last a little while; some linger. Presently I'm obsessed with quinoa, as I have mentioned before. My favorite is quinoa a la ranchera from Whole Foods, but they messed with me today. Instead they had a version with red oinion, chives, perhaps a small amount of mint, red pepper and currants. I like it and will gobble it down over the course of the weekend, but I do hope they bring back my beloved ranchera style.

In the meantime, I'm prepared to try making it next weekend when I return from another business trip. I have also purchased quinoa pasta. Normally I'm like "ew, give me real pasta or no pasta." Forget spelt or whatever, but quinoa, I'm willing to try.

[ol_ironstomach]

Still TBD: whether their Enomatic will eventually be networked with other Whole Foods stores that share the tasting bar concept. Obvious benefits: wouldn't need to float (or track) multiple stored-value cards. Also, their data system records your tasting history, so you can ask them to recall what you've tasted on such-and-such a date.

Note to self: definitely, definitely block out some time to visit with a copy of Jancis Robinson's How To Taste. This is so much more economical and reliable than blindly sourcing your own "example" bottles, that it's almost criminal. Think they'd let me bring my own tasting glasses instead of using their basic Riedel house stems?

[mdt]

Note to self: definitely, definitely block out some time to visit with a copy of Jancis Robinson's How To Taste. This is so much more economical and reliable than blindly sourcing your own "example" bottles, that it's almost criminal. Think they'd let me bring my own tasting glasses instead of using their basic Riedel house stems?

Holy crap Dave that is a great idea! I would definitely be up for that.

[jparrott]

Holy crap Dave that is a great idea! I would definitely be up for that.

Way too good an idea. Way, way, way too good an idea.

[Al Dente]

Think they'd let me bring my own tasting glasses instead of using their basic Riedel house stems?

Probably. Call ahead and ask for the wine dept.

It is a beautiful room up there, isn't it?

[jparrott]

WF's tasting room stems are just fine for tasting/evaluation, IMHO.

[Anna Blume]

Does anyone else buy the family packs of chicken leg quarters?

They were on sale yesterday, so I picked up one in addition to wings to make chicken stock. Bell & Evans does the butchering, and I had forgotten that the word "quarters" means that they are not just the leg.

Each piece comes with backbone, tail and guts (mostly liver-bits) still attached. One leg had the entire backbone attached. I took out my scale to find that of the 4.5 pounds of chicken I purchased, only 2.57 pounds were the legs (including skin, bones, etc.). The rest was stuff B & E would have presumably discarded. This is not a bargain, especially for someone who is planning to cook the pieces some other way.

[ol_ironstomach]

WF's tasting room stems are just fine for tasting/evaluation, IMHO.

I was thinking of avoiding my problem of being a klutz and accidentally breaking stems until they ban me. Only half kidding.

Seriously, it's good to know that you think the house glasses are suitable. These things aren't obvious to us beginners, especially when wine authors seem bent these days on including chapters on specialized glass shapes, including the INAO/ISO glasses.

An additional advantage I had overlooked: the Enomatics are individually set to temps that I presume are appropriate to the range of wines inside, something that would be difficult to accomplish at home. The exception would probably be freshly changed-out bottles, which are pulled from the display stock and would be at ambient temp.

[mdt]

Some info on the chefs at the new WF from this article in the Post.

The Fair Lakes store hired chefs who have worked in some of the area's best restaurants. Dale Stirzel, a Culinary Institute of America grad, worked at the Inn at Little Washington. John Campbell was executive chef at Restaurant Nora in Washington and at Falls Landing in Great Falls. Pat Busby was chef-owner of Mooring restaurant. Annette Cuellar, a graduate of L'Academie de Cuisine in Bethesda, worked at Zola and Maestro. Veteran sushi chef Kevin Ly is a native of Vietnam who has worked in Japanese restaurants worldwide.

[ScotteeM]

I made a field trip out to the new WF in Fair Lakes today. It's big and shiny, and even a tad overwhelming, but I liked it more than I expected to. I circled all of the eateries and finally landed in a seat at the smoke house (?). I tasted the brisket, pulled pork, spare ribs, and chicken, as well as the mashed potatoes, greens, and beans. Oh yeah, the regular cornbread, too. That was the "Kitchen Sink" option. For $15 I got a huge amount of food (brought half of it home) and a nice glass of lemonade.

I really liked the smoked meats just plain. They were moist and smoky, and I could tell one from another. I wasn't crazy about their barbecue sauces, which were either too sweet (the maple, which should have been my favorite) or too spicy (the North Carolina--it's just me, I think), or too something (sweet again?) (the Texas mustard). The mashed potatoes were good enough, but not great (not enough salt, potato flavor, cream?). The greens were lost in a sweet-hot sauce that obliterated the flavor of the collards themselves. I'm not a baked bean connosieur, but I thought the beans were good. Of the three, I liked the potatoes best.

The service was excellent, and I was surprised that they don't allow tipping. When the server heard from another customer that the lemonade was really tart, she asked me to taste the glass she had just given me. I agreed, and she took it back and made it sweeter--just right, in fact.

The store itself is huge, with service counters spanning almost the whole periphery, for cut up fruit, seafood, meats, cheese, smoked meats . . . on and on for miles (or so thought my feet). I scored a nice-looking piece of hanger steak for dinner tonight, along with some good deals on fresh fruit.

The salad bars and hot-food bars look about the same as those at the Old Town Alexandria store--also the soup bars and dessert bar. The cooked seafood bar seems larger, although the shrimp looked mostly very overcooked. The seafood section has an attractive display of whole fish on ice that aren't behind glass, to evoke the feel of a fish market.

I'm not going to make the special trip out there very often, mainly because I have no other reason to go out there, but I will go occasionally, and I will send my husband to check out the wine department.

Oh, the staff were all very nice, and seemed happy to be there.

ETA: The above was written as soon as I got home, before I unpacked my groceries. The check-out staff probably just needs a little more experience. They packed my seafood bar container in the same bag as my instant oatmeal. The shrimp leaked and saturated the oatmeal box, but I think I saved all but one packet from the box. The container of trail mix that I thought was sealed (they usually are) came open in the plastic grocery bag which tipped and spilled trail mix in my car. The containers that the individual eggs are placed in for transport home are amazingly flimsy and the clerk managed to smash the little interlocking bumps so they wouldn't stay closed. They're different containers than I've gotten in the past at the Alexandria WF, which is why this surprised me. At least the eggs made it home intact.

[Ilaine]

I had a bad experience with my grocery bagger at the new WF, myself.

She tried to stuff everything into one bag, which ripped, then she tried to hand me the ripped bag, anyway.

I asked her to re-bag into more than one bag -- at some point, when I wasn't watching, she put a lot of heavy stuff on top of the bananas.

Taught me a lesson that I can be a sexist. For some reason I assumed that women were more attentive to such matters, not that men can't be wonderful baggers, but this requires some thought, like put all the frozen stuff together in one bag, don't put bread or fruit or eggs in the bottom of the bag, etc.

In contrast, the next trip, my bagger was a young male, definitely teenaged, and he was extremely careful.

[Waitman]

I know I'm in a bad mood because I'm just a weensy bit hungover and I've been up working since 7AM, but I was in the P St. Whole Foods and I'm sorry, anyone who is so lame they have to buy their green beans with the tips already cut off (and turning brown) and their red peppers pre-sliced and getting soggy should just stop frontin' and go to the Safeway for the frozen crap.

Also, the Camembert was a little piss-smelling.

[Heather]

Also, the Camembert was a little piss-smelling.

Isn't it always? It certainly is at the Silver Spring location.

Can I express a little hatred for the stupid clamshell packaging that WF now uses for spices? It's not airtight, so everything has to be transferred into something else lest is get stale, but the quantity you get is too much for the average spice jar. And at least one is guaranteed to pop open in the cabinet, spilling chili powder or oregano all over the place.

[Anna Blume]

Can I express a little hatred for the stupid clamshell packaging that WF now uses for spices? It's not airtight, so everything has to be transferred into something else lest is get stale, but the quantity you get is too much for the average spice jar. And at least one is guaranteed to pop open in the cabinet, spilling chili powder or oregano all over the place.

I have been complaining to the store ever since they started doing this!!!! You just have to wonder about the culinary expertise of management who are making decisions like this.

The spices lose flavor quickly enough in clear containers; it's a lot worse in plastic vs. glass. That's one reason I stopped buying spices in bulk some time after I lost my identity as a food co-op member. The only worthwhile purchases are the peppercorns if they've been packaged recently or the bay leaves.

Second, the amounts packed into clam shells are arbitrary. Unless you're making gobs of chili or curry powder and serving chilies or curries once a week to a good-sized household, a clamshell full of cayenne pepper or cumin is simply not going to stay fresh before you use it up even if it might have been fresh when you bought it.

Does anyone in regional management at WF read this board?

[mdt]

I have been complaining to the store ever since they started doing this!!!! You just have to wonder about the culinary expertise of management who are making decisions like this.

The spices lose flavor quickly enough in clear containers; it's a lot worse in plastic vs. glass. That's one reason I stopped buying spices in bulk some time after I lost my identity as a food co-op member. The only worthwhile purchases are the peppercorns if they've been packaged recently or the bay leaves.

Second, the amounts packed into clam shells are arbitrary. Unless you're making gobs of chili or curry powder and serving chilies or curries once a week to a good-sized household, a clamshell full of cayenne pepper or cumin is simply not going to stay fresh before you use it up even if it might have been fresh when you bought it.

Does anyone in regional management at WF read this board?

I guess I am too practical, but just package the leftover spices in Ziploc freezer bags and put them in the freezer. They will keep their potency for a very long time that way.

[Meaghan]

I'm very upset. My Whole Foods is regularly out of the pre-packaged whole cashew nuts that I like, string cheese and turkey jerky. Those are my snacks and they never have them anymo'. And today they were having a pre-pre-Superbowl sample-mania so that there were massive back-ups caused by greedy shoppers taking more than their share of oversweet BBQ, flaxseed cereal and a trio of chinken wings. BEEP BEEP BEEP.

[hm212]

WF's tasting room stems are just fine for tasting/evaluation, IMHO.

I was there today. The glass stems are fine and the tasting room is really fun. Bought a couple of bottles to bring away on my trip next month.

[The Hersch]

Can I express a little hatred for the stupid clamshell packaging that WF now uses for spices?

Holy God. They do? I haven't had the joy yet. A couple of months ago I noticed that all the DC stores seemed to be out of dried herbs/spices, with tags on the few remaining ones that said "discontinued item" or something. These things have been packaged in glass jars and tins from time immemorial for a reason. I guess the clamshell packaging for fresh herbs, which is among the stupidest packaging to come along since, oh, the "jewel case" for CDs, which take up three times as much space as they need to and break irreparably when dropped on a carpeted floor, seemed like such a good idea that they decided to run with it. Maybe they'll package rice and dried beans that way next. Or soup.

[ScotteeM]

I guess the clamshell packaging for fresh herbs, which is among the stupidest packaging to come along since, oh, the "jewel case" for CDs, which take up three times as much space as they need to and break unrepairably when dropped on a carpeted floor, seemed like such a good idea that they decided to run with it. Maybe they'll package rice and dried beans that way next. Or soup.

They already do package dried beans that way, not to mention nuts and trail mix. In theory, they are heat sealed to stay closed, but my trail mix broke open in my car on Thursday, and spilled a little. I think the nuts and trail mixes go stale or rancid more easily in that packaging. And they do take up too much space.

[Ilaine]

Second, the amounts packed into clam shells are arbitrary. Unless you're making gobs of chili or curry powder and serving chilies or curries once a week to a good-sized household, a clamshell full of cayenne pepper or cumin is simply not going to stay fresh before you use it up even if it might have been fresh when you bought it.

That's it in a nutshell, really (in a clamshell?) I really didn't need a pound of mace. And freezing it in a ziplock will only make it so far. Freezer burn is yuuuuck. But the price was too good to pass up.

And yes, they do package beans and rice and powdered soup mix that way, not to mention trail mix and crunchy snacks and dried mushrooms and dried fruit and nuts and anything else dry you can think of. Wasabi peas. I could go on.