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Pizza - The Best Methods And Techniques to Make it At Home


alan7147

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I guess this belongs more in the grilling area, then.

I've only ever used charcoal. For wood, do I just buy wood and burn it in the grill? How much should I use? Do I put the pizza on instantly or let it burn down to coals?

Basically I want to recreate a big brick wood-burning oven in a Weber kettle.

Never going to happen as those big brick ovens cook via the heat that is stored in the brick. The fire is there to keep the grill hot for a long period of time. The only thing you can do with any grill is make a grilled pizza, but it will get some smokey flavor.

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Never going to happen as those big brick ovens cook via the heat that is stored in the brick. The fire is there to keep the grill hot for a long period of time. The only thing you can do with any grill is make a grilled pizza, but it will get some smokey flavor.
Two things to add here. First of all, this may be completely illegal and probably dangerous but last time I cooked pizzas I rigged the latch on my oven to keep from locking when I was in "clean" mode. I think that the clean cycle got a good 300 degrees hotter than my maximum allowed 550. At that temp it only took about a minute to char the bottom and the top a bit. The last half of my pizzas were damn near 2amys quality. A couple of things I have learned, I put the pizza stone as close to the top as I can while still being able to move the pizza in and out of the oven. When I kept it at the bottom, the stone would be much hotter than the air and the bottom would crust up way before the top. If I waited for the top to brown the bottom would be rock hard. Putting the stone at the top has helped even out the top/bottom cooking times. I don't like brushing olive oil on the crust because I feel like it affects the rise. I don't seem to get as much poof out of the crust when I do this. Instead I just sprinkle some sea salt all around the outer ring. No one leaves their crusts on the plate anymore.

Ok on the grilling pizza I don't think you will ever get results like an oven. The problem is that as soon as you lift the lid all your hot air disappears. I think the air needs to actually be hotter than the stone to make a perfect pizza. This may be completely crazy, way more work than it is worth and wildly unsafe but what about setting up a rig for two stones? Drill four small holes in the lid of your grill and bolt on some small metal hooks. Get four small c-clamps and put one on each corner of a pizza stone, attach wire to each one with a small loop or hook at the other end. Use enough wire that the stone would hang 4-5 inches above the grate. Whenever you wanted to do a pizza you just attach the top stone to the hooks before you preheat. Also I disagree with whoever said one chimney of coals. When cooking pizza the hotter the better. Heck I might use three. If it has to cook for over 4-5 minutes it is too cool in my opinion. If you preheat both of those stones with three chimney's of coals for 30-45 minutes I would be willing to bet there would be enough residual heat in that top stone to blister the top of the pizza just like a brick oven.

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I guess this belongs more in the grilling area, then.

I've only ever used charcoal. For wood, do I just buy wood and burn it in the grill? How much should I use? Do I put the pizza on instantly or let it burn down to coals?

Basically I want to recreate a big brick wood-burning oven in a Weber kettle.

You seem to enjoy cooking outside and want to replicate dishes authentically so why not carve out a section of your backyard and build an oven yourself? You could crank out pizzas, bread, roasts, etc. all day after firing the thing up in the morning as they hold a great deal of heat.

Click.

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You seem to enjoy cooking outside and want to replicate dishes authentically so why not carve out a section of your backyard and build an oven yourself? You could crank out pizzas, bread, roasts, etc. all day after firing the thing up in the morning as they hold a great deal of heat.

Click.

That is on my list of things to do in my life. I've wanted one ever since I was a kid. Once I move into a permanent home, expect to see a thread started about my efforts :angry:
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America's Test Kitchen did a pizza on the grill this past weekend using a Weber. They turned out beautiful...not sure about the taste. You might want to check it out to see how they rigged it...seem to recall that they used hardwood charcoal started in a chimney keeping a cool spot to one side. (recipe is here)

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Let's talk a little about HEAT.

Big wood burning ovens (forno) WORK. We know they work, and they work for two reasons:

1) The surface of the ovens retains heat. This allows conduction to take place between the bottom of the crust and the oven surface, resulting in a crisp and sturdy crust button.

2) The air in the oven retains heat. This allows convection to do its work - cooking the toppings thoroughly, melting (but not burning) the cheese, and ensuring an even and crisp rise of the crust rim.

For the home cook, #1 is easy to duplicate: pizza stone. There's no question that this WORKS.

#2, though... that's another story. When you open the oven to stick the pie in, all the air flows out. Now you've got a 300 degree oven but a 550 pizza stone. Worst case, you end up with a burnt bottom and undercooked top. The effect is even more pronounced in a grill we're you've got a dedicated heat source at the bottom and tons of heat coming out of the top when you lift the lid.

Does anyone have any strategies for retaining heat, or otherwise duplicating the environment of a commercial or brick pizza oven using a conventional home oven? What about using a convection setting? Or would the fact that most ovens limit the convection setting to 400 degrees tops make it pointless?

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America's Test Kitchen did a pizza on the grill this past weekend using a Weber. They turned out beautiful...not sure about the taste. You might want to check it out to see how they rigged it...seem to recall that they used hardwood charcoal started in a chimney keeping a cool spot to one side. (recipe is here)
Just noticed this post. I've been using their recipe and method for the last two summers with great success. I'll admit that their crust may not taste like traditional crust. To me, it's almost more like a flatbread - it has a nice, slightly chewy texture and a well developed flavour (which I think is thanks to the fact they use bread flour and olive oil in the dough). I crank up the flavour a bit by going heavier on the garlic and herbs and sometimes even adding some hot red chilis to it.

Having the cool spot on the grill is essential to melt the cheese. I cook the bread on the hot side until I get just a little char, then flip, add toppings, move to the cool side of the grill and close the lid. It doesn't take more than a few minutes per side and I've never had a complaint about the results (maybe everyone was being kind...who knows?).

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Does anyone have any strategies for retaining heat, or otherwise duplicating the environment of a commercial or brick pizza oven using a conventional home oven? What about using a convection setting? Or would the fact that most ovens limit the convection setting to 400 degrees tops make it pointless?
Jeffrey Steingarten has a pretty good story in one of his books where he talks about using the "clean" cycle on an oven to bake pizza (since it gets the temp way hotter than the oven will normally go-- like 700). However, he tried this at a friend's place not knowing that the oven locks during the cleaning cycle (with the pizza inside :angry: )
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Does anyone have any strategies for retaining heat, or otherwise duplicating the environment of a commercial or brick pizza oven using a conventional home oven? What about using a convection setting? Or would the fact that most ovens limit the convection setting to 400 degrees tops make it pointless?

I line my rack with unglazed tiles (too much of a minimalist to store a pizza stone) and preheat for at least 30 minutes at 485 degrees. I find that the hot tiles radiate plenty of heat to keep my oven nice and toasty while I slide a pizza in. My MIL has had problems using this technique only when her dough is too thick or the toppings have been piled on too thick. The mktye trick of making your pizza on parchment and sliding it into the oven with parchment and all also makes for quick and speedy pizza transfers.

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Does anyone have any strategies for retaining heat, or otherwise duplicating the environment of a commercial or brick pizza oven using a conventional home oven?

Use two pizza stones.

Place the racks containing the stones as close together as you can, but far enough apart so your pizza (or bread) fits between them (if baking bread, be sure to take into account space for the bread to rise) and put your pizza (or bread) on the lower one.

It works like a charm with pizza (and I noticed nearly a 50% increase in oven-spring with my free-form loaves of bread).

(And the only time I ever remove my baking stones from the oven is when I cook macarons -- a lesson I learned the hard way. :angry: )

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Use two pizza stones.

Place the racks containing the stones as close together as you can, but far enough apart so your pizza (or bread) fits between them (if baking bread, be sure to take into account space for the bread to rise) and put your pizza (or bread) on the lower one.

It works like a charm with pizza (and I noticed nearly a 50% increase in oven-spring with my free-form loaves of bread).

(And the only time I ever remove my baking stones from the oven is when I cook macarons -- a lesson I learned the hard way. :angry: )

Wow, such a simple solution. I'm totally trying this.

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Thanks, guys. I'll definitely try the multiple stone approach. Usually I have two pizzas going at once on two stones anyway - I'll just add a third!

Okay, we've talked about HEATING pizza, let's talk about FREEZING pizza.

I do a cold ferment on my dough, so that means if I want pizza I have to wait at least a day. Sometimes I don't want to wait a day, and it's just as easy to make a triple recipe of dough as it is a single recipe. The question is, what's the best time to freeze the dough/pizza so I have some ready to go when the CRAVING sets in?

1) BEFORE THE RISE

Probably a bad idea.

2) AFTER THE RISE

This is the stage at which you'll find dough frozen at the grocery store. The disadvantage here is that you still have to thaw the dough, let it come to room temperature, shape it, rest it, shape it, rest it, etc. This can take hours. Not good if you want oven fresh pizza on a weeknight.

3) AFTER SHAPING

So the dough is rested and tossed, but still raw. Layer the discs on wax paper. Fits easily in the freezer. Take the frozen dough out, top it, and toss it in the oven.

4) AFTER COOKING

Shape the dough, top the pizza, then toss it in the oven for about half its usual cooking time. Take it out, freeze it. When you want it again, just toss it in the oven!

So... what's the best stage to freeze the pizza? Will you end up with textural or flavor differences at any stage? #4 is obviously the most convenient for reheating, but what do you lose in exchange for convenience? In #3 and #4, should the dough/pizza be thawed before going in the oven, or can the frozen pie go right in?

What say you?

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4) AFTER COOKING

Shape the dough, top the pizza, then toss it in the oven for about half its usual cooking time. Take it out, freeze it. When you want it again, just toss it in the oven!

So... what's the best stage to freeze the pizza? Will you end up with textural or flavor differences at any stage? #4 is obviously the most convenient for reheating, but what do you lose in exchange for convenience? In #3 and #4, should the dough/pizza be thawed before going in the oven, or can the frozen pie go right in?

What say you?

My vote is for #4, but don't top it. Partially bake it until it is set and just starting to color. Remove, cool, wrap well and freeze. Then defrost, top and bake. It works especially well with thin-crust pizzas.

As for defrosting -- I've found that with a thin crust, if you take it out of the freezer when you start to prep your toppings, by the time you slather them on, it is defrosted enough to go in the oven. For thicker crusts, I'd make sure to fully defrost it before topping and baking (pull it out of the freezer when you leave for work in the morning?).

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I lined the top and bottom of my oven with unglazed quarry stone. I adjusted the thermostat to read 35 degrees below normal (so 550 was really 585).

The result?

Best pizza ever.

Five of the six pies, after baking for three minutes, I froze for later use. The sixth I topped with St. Pete's blue cheese, golden delicious apples, salt, pepper, and agave syrup. Probably the best thing I've ever put in my mouth.

Will let everyone know the results of the freezing once I decide to thaw and cook in the next two weeks.

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So, I recently received a pizza stone and I was wondering how to best use it and if anyone had any good pizza dough recipes. OR if it would just be easier to purchase the dough (please list good brands or locations to purchase.)

Vace on Conn. Ave has servicable pre-made dough.

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Vace on Conn. Ave has servicable pre-made dough.
As does Litteri, from what I understand.

My pizza stone just split in two, recently, when I impatiently topped the raw dough w hot tomato sauce and failed to slide the pie on neatly.

Morals: It pays to invest in a paddle, too. Let your toppings cool, first.

* * *

I use Deborah Madison's recipe in *Vegetarian Cooking for Everyone*--an improvement over earlier ones. A little bit of flour that isn't bleached or unbleached white adds flavor. Even better is a dough you make ahead (like the stores do) and "age" a couple of days in the fridge. You have to let it sit out on the counter to return to room temperature for a while--as you must with store-bought doughs.

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For the past few years, I've been using the whole wheat pizza dough recipe from The New Basics Cookbook. It's not quite half whole wheat flour, which I find adds some extra body but isn't too heavy.

These are the ingredients:

1 cup warm water

1 pkg. active dry yeast

1 1/2 cups unbleached all-purpose flour

1 cup whole-wheat flour

2 Tablespoons olive oil

1/2 teaspoon salt

This makes 2 pizzas, about 12" each.

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Click for dough recipe.

Really, pizza dough is so easy (and FUN) that there's no excuse for buying storebought. Your dough (and subsequent crust) is one of the most important parts of your pizza, and the only way to ensure quality control is to do it yourself. Sure, toppings are great and you can really be creative with them... but would you buy a gorgeous diamond and set it in brass?

PS - I've never broken a pizza stone. I've spilled all kinds of crap on mine, too. Maybe I'm just lucky?

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Even better is a dough you make ahead (like the stores do) and "age" a couple of days in the fridge. You have to let it sit out on the counter to return to room temperature for a while--as you must with store-bought doughs.
Yes yes YES. More than fancy flour or snazzy herbs or imported water does a good cold ferment contribute to the flavor and texture of your dough. You should never make pizza from scratch unless you can devote at LEAST eight hours of fridge time to the dough.
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This is the recipe I use:

Pizza Dough

2 tsp yeast

1.5 c warm water

2 tbsp olive oil

1 tsp salt

4 c flour

Cornmeal

Combine water and yeast. Whisk in oil and salt. Gradually add flour. Push together and knead by hand until smooth. Put in oiled bowl, cover with plastic, and let rise until doubled. Punch down and let rise overnight in refrigerator. Scatter cornmeal on peel. Pull dough into a round of desired thickness. Place on peel. Top as desired and shake onto stone. Bake at 500 degrees in a stone oven, usually about 10 minutes.

This recipe makes two medium-sized pizzas with a nice, not-thick not-thin crust.

Be sure you heat the oven with the stone for at least 45min before you bake the pizza. Also, jerk the peel with the dough on it around a few times before you top the pizza to be sure the pizza is moving (if not, take the dough off and add more cornmeal). Top it quickly because if it sits on the peel with a bunch of wet toppings for too long, the dough gets wet and sticks to the peel. Also, I don't own a peel so I use a medium-sized wood cutting board instead (use wood because if it touches the hot stone it won't melt). I usually slide an offset spatula under the pizza before I pull it out to make sure it's not sticking to the stone.

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Thanks! I plan trying one of these recipes over this weekend.

Whatever recipe you use, make a large batch. After the first rise break it up into 1lb. portions and freeze them for future use. You can take it out of the freezer in the morning and have it ready to go by dinner.

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Whatever recipe you use, make a large batch. After the first rise break it up into 1lb. portions and freeze them for future use. You can take it out of the freezer in the morning and have it ready to go by dinner.

Thanks! The dough is done and i will certainly do that. First pizza comes out of the oven at noon today. WOHO!

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This is the recipe I use:

Pizza Dough

2 tsp yeast

1.5 c warm water

2 tbsp olive oil

1 tsp salt

4 c flour

Cornmeal

Combine water and yeast. Whisk in oil and salt. Gradually add flour. Push together and knead by hand until smooth. Put in oiled bowl, cover with plastic, and let rise until doubled. Punch down and let rise overnight in refrigerator. Scatter cornmeal on peel. Pull dough into a round of desired thickness. Place on peel. Top as desired and shake onto stone. Bake at 500 degrees in a stone oven, usually about 10 minutes.

This recipe makes two medium-sized pizzas with a nice, not-thick not-thin crust.

Be sure you heat the oven with the stone for at least 45min before you bake the pizza. Also, jerk the peel with the dough on it around a few times before you top the pizza to be sure the pizza is moving (if not, take the dough off and add more cornmeal). Top it quickly because if it sits on the peel with a bunch of wet toppings for too long, the dough gets wet and sticks to the peel. Also, I don't own a peel so I use a medium-sized wood cutting board instead (use wood because if it touches the hot stone it won't melt). I usually slide an offset spatula under the pizza before I pull it out to make sure it's not sticking to the stone.

Used the recipe above and it was GREAT! Kudos!

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Made a batch of pizza on Sunday. Read on for what I made and some tips to take to the bank.

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Going clockwise from the upper left:

-My toppings mise en place

-Plain cheese pizza. For the first time, I made my own tomato sauce rather than relying on storebought. Usually I use the stuff from the store simply because making the sauce at home just means another dirty pot. Not sure I'll go back, though. Mine was made with tomatoes I dried in the oven at around 300 degrees, which gave the sauce a wonderful sweetness and an almost smoky flavor, which was an absolute delight as, without a wood burning oven, I am unable to get the rustic smokiness I so love in American Flatbread's pies any other way.

-This was my take on AF's "Revolution" pizza. I sweated some onions for about forty-five minutes in olive oil, layered that on some of the tomato sauce, topped with cheese, and finished with a ton of sliced cremini mushrooms. Earthy and delicious.

-Sausage with ricotta. This is a crowd pleaser and, along with the plain cheese, one of the two pizzas I make every time. I cook the sausage through in a frying pan first, then rest them in the fridge in a bunch of paper towels to 1) remove the grease and 2) ensure no one gets raw pork. I wrap the ricotta in cheesecloth and suspend it over a bowl in the fridge to drain it. This keeps it from getting watery and gives it a nice brown top.

-I roasted some onion, parsnip, and celery root, then I tossed it in the leftover port and honey sauce from my Christmas party's braised short ribs (sweet and beefy!), then topped with a bit of bacon and some aged cheddar. This was fantastic - the veggies were crisp and rooty, the sauce was lip-smacking and rich - a perfect winter pizza. I overcooked the veggies a bit (forgetting that they were going back in the oven once they got on the pizza), so they were kinda bitter, but overall a fine effort.

-This was my personal favorite because it incorporated some of my favorite flavors. I cooked up some bacon in a frying pan, removed the bacon and fat (reserving the fat for later biscuit efforts), then tossed in some shallots. I deglazed the pan with the liquid leftover from hydrating some porcinis, some red wine, and some balsamic vinegar. I reduced and strained, then brushed it on the crust. I topped it with the porcinis and bacon, cooked, then topped with parmesan and truffle oil. HEAVEN.

-Pepperoni and ricotta. I used to not care for pepperoni pizza because of how orange and greasy the pie would get. Now what I do is layer the pepperoni in paper towels and microwave them for about a minute before topping the pizza. Pure pepperoni perfection!

You'll notice that most of the pies are garnished with herbs. This is as much for presentation as for flavor, and I'm sure to add them AFTER the pizzas come out of the oven to prevent them from losing flavor and going dry. The mix is of fresh sage, fresh basil, a touch of fresh rosemary, and some dried oregano.

This also marks the first time I replaced half of my bread flour with semolina (from Wegman's). WOW. It made an amazing difference in the texture and flavor of the crust, and I will never, EVER go back to using just bread flour. One note, though... I'm not sure if the semolina absorbed more milk or what, but the final dough ended up being a bit drier than usual, so if you want to try semolina as well, be sure to add more liquid accordingly.

All in all, my best effort thanks to:

1) Semolina

2) Herb topping

3) Homemade tomato sauce

4) Topping tech

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Made a huge batch of dough this morning in preparation for the Super Bowl tomorrow. I decided to use Reinhart's excellent recipe that calls for making the dough with cold water and a long raise in the fridge. It is a great recipe because it is simple and produces excellent results.

14 oz APF or Bread Flour

1 tsp yeast

1.75 tsp salt

14 oz. of water that is chilled to 40F

Mix everything together and knead in the mixer for 5-7 minutes, after which the dough should be 50-55F. Take out, flour lightly and let it rest in the fridge overnight. You can portion it up now or after the rest.

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What kind?

Don't you find that your dough tears really easily after only 5-7 minutes of kneading? How do you stretch/flatten the final product?

I use Red Star active dry yeast, although PR calls for instant yeast. I actually use the active dry the same way as the instant, just put it in and mix it up. If I have any doubt that my yeast is bad I test a small amount before using it, but I rarely ever have yeast sitting around that long.

I have no trouble stretching the dough with only 5-7 minutes of kneading as my mixer is pretty strong. I don't follow the time so much as looking at the dough. My guess is that I probably kneaded it for 9 as I had to adjust the water a bit as my flour was pretty dry. The final result is a smooth and slightly sticky dough. To shape I create a small disk when I first take it out of the fridge to set it warm, then I just slowly stretch it on my wooden cutting board or if I am feeling especially chipper use the back of my hands and tossing.

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Anyone have any unique or creative topping ideas? I'm looking to try something new this weekend, and my internal muse seems to be out to lunch.

Years ago at a restaurant where I worked, there was a "German Pizza" that tasted fantastic, but did not sell very well (it was an Italian-themed restaurant so consumers weren't exactly there for German-influenced food, you know?) so it got pulled from the menu after only a month or so. If I remember correctly, it had pretzel salt and was egg-washed on the edges of the crust and was topped with a mustard-based cream sauce, sauerkraut (be sure to wring it out well) and slices of German wurst. I think it may have also been topped with something pickled as well (red onions?). I recall that it was a staff favorite and was fantastic with a few beers!

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Okay, I'm looking for some brainstorms here.

Take a look at these four pies from Bebo, Red Rocks, Comet, and 2 Amys:

http://dcist.com/2007/09/18/the_fab_forno_f.php

Then take a look at my pies up above.

The professional pizzas appear to be white with dots of black. My pizzas appear to be more of a gold color.

Why do you think this is?

Theories:

1) My dough uses sugar, but maybe theirs do not (thus less carmelization)?

2) My dough uses olive oil, which is yellowish, but maybe theirs do not?

3) The ovens at the restaurants at hotter than mine (a given, but does it explain the difference)?

4) I use semolina flour (which is yellow) in addition to white bread flour, but maybe they don't?

5) Other?

It looks like the professional pies are lighter, fluffier, crisper.

Thoughts?

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88533257gr6.th.jpg

Bacon cheeseburger pizza

Pizza margherita

Yum.

I tried upping the liquid in my dough recipe to compensate for the increased absorbative powers of the semolina, but by way too much. I'd say 3/4 cups plus 1-2 tbl of milk should be about right.

The margherita was made with wonderful moz I got from Wegman's and tons of homemade basil oil. The tomatoes and moz were both dried thoroughly in paper towels before going on the pie ('cause you don't want wet pizza).

The bacon cheeseburger pizza was something special. Tomato sauce, lots of thick-cut bacon, ground beef, moz, aged cheddar, and the onions. Hoo boy the onions. I sauteed them in the frying pan I'd used to cook sausage, beef, and bacon, so the onions absorbed the fat and browned bits of each type of meat. They were sublime.

The margherita was sliced and mauled before I could take a picture.

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Okay, I'm looking for some brainstorms here.

Take a look at these four pies from Bebo, Red Rocks, Comet, and 2 Amys:

http://dcist.com/2007/09/18/the_fab_forno_f.php

Then take a look at my pies up above.

The professional pizzas appear to be white with dots of black. My pizzas appear to be more of a gold color.

Why do you think this is?

Theories:

1) My dough uses sugar, but maybe theirs do not (thus less carmelization)?

2) My dough uses olive oil, which is yellowish, but maybe theirs do not?

3) The ovens at the restaurants at hotter than mine (a given, but does it explain the difference)?

4) I use semolina flour (which is yellow) in addition to white bread flour, but maybe they don't?

5) Other?

It looks like the professional pies are lighter, fluffier, crisper.

Thoughts?

It may be several factors, but mainly I believe it's the heat-you just can't get the same blister effect at 500 degrees as you can at 700+ degrees.

My pizza is also golden on the bottom and gets no blister

2281795721_39559e4f42.jpg

2281807407_0ebaff350f.jpg

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Okay, I'm looking for some brainstorms here.

5) Other?

It looks like the professional pies are lighter, fluffier, crisper.

Thoughts?

Dan, I would try stretching the dough a little thinner and adding less of the toppings. I can get a little char on mine using a crappy little oven cranked up all the way, but we stretch out the crust, and top them sparingly.
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Cook the pizza on the Gas Grill Outside. Either directly on the grates or heat a stone in there for 20 minutes before cooking on the stone.
I've never gotten good results on the grill. You lose way too much heat no matter how quickly you open the lid. Basically you end up with a charred bottom and an undercooked top. The only way around this is to flip the pizza like you would anything else on the grill, but even doing that it's nigh impossible to get your toppings properly caramelized, regardless of how light you go on 'em.
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I've never gotten good results on the grill. You lose way too much heat no matter how quickly you open the lid. Basically you end up with a charred bottom and an undercooked top. The only way around this is to flip the pizza like you would anything else on the grill, but even doing that it's nigh impossible to get your toppings properly caramelized, regardless of how light you go on 'em.

You're supposed to flip grilled pizza...can't be made any other way. Because the critical step is apparently to top lightly and very quickly after the flip, so the residual heat from the first-baked side contributes to cooking the toppings. Haven't experimented with it myself, as it's one of the few things the TEC grill doesn't do well, and I haven't the patience to fire up the charcoal kettle most of the time.

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You're supposed to flip grilled pizza...can't be made any other way.
Exactly. But, again, no matter how light you go on the toppings - they'll COOK via conduction from the dough and limited convection from the air, but to cook them WELL you really need radiation and hot air flow for proper caramelization.

Wow. That two-stone pizza grill may very well be what I've been looking for all this time. $257 is a bit much, though - I bet I can build something even better.

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