mdt Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 there is a fairly new french place on 17th street that almost sucked when we visited a month or so back when we were diverted on our way to hank's oyster bar. it had the bistro du coin attitude, plus dubious food. Le Pigalle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPW Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Le Pigalle?I didn't eat there, but the menu did look dubious. Had a drink at the bar and didn't really notice too much attitude. The patio is really nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monica Bhide Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Does anyone else have the morbid curiosity to try this place out after it is identified? I will go if you will go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bilrus Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 I just looked on the Le Pigalle thread and this was the last, mysterious quote from Rocks: A reminder to all employees of Le Pigalle: there's a mandatory staff meeting on Monday, July 3rd. Could this be a clue, a few weeks early? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiral Stairs Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Thus spake Sietsema: Zero stars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tujague Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Tom said in a chat in late June that he had not yet been to Le Pigalle, so I'm surprised that he got this done so quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bilrus Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Looks like technically Giant Shrimp is the winner, although Rocks appears to have edged him out by a month or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 A fully deserved zero stars, I might add. Based on my first, and hopefully last, visit, Le Pigalle is HORRIBLE. It was fun seeing Tom trash this place. Usually in his reviews, he'll have a contrarian paragraph about two-thirds in, starting with something like "But not everything is a winner." Here, he did it in reverse, straining to go into great detail about what was salvageable - it's pretty clear he was trying to be extra fair and accountable given that he bageled the joint. Cheers, Rocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Scott and I stopped by Le Pigalle for a glass of wine before dinner at Komi two weeks ago. We asked what wines were available by the glass and got an answer like "Uh, a Pinot Noir, a Malbec, and, um, Chardonnay". Our reds tasted like they were served fresh from the oven. Plenty of people sitting outside, almost none of them eating anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banco Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 The best of the middling meat dishes is the veal piccata, layered with mushroom duxelles, a slice of ham and Swiss cheese, and lapped with a thick mustard sauce. What the hell does any of that have to do with a piccata? Oh well, at least now I know that Capitol Hill is not the only place in DC where bad restaurants waste great real estate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrescentFresh Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Our reds tasted like they were served fresh from the oven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertyy Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 "At Least the Water Is Cold" is a superb headline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hersch Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Bring back Sun Food, is what I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdt Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Plenty of people sitting outside, almost none of them eating anything. I have walked by on my way to Hank's and saw many people outside that were eating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 I have walked by on my way to Hank's and saw many people outside that were eating.Brave souls, apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Landrum Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Oh well, at least now I know that Capitol Hill is not the only place in DC where bad restaurants waste great real estate. Perhaps the notion that the real estate in DC is great for restaurants is a faulty premise here. It is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treznor Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 What I find somewhat odd is the user reviews for Le Pigalle. Now granted, usually I just read them to get a laugh as there's always people saying "Best Place EVAR" and others saying "OHMIGOD The food tasted like dog poop", but in the case of Le Pigalle every single review except for 1 (of the 12) were either 1 star or 4 star. Typically there's at least a couple in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banco Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Perhaps the notion that the real estate in DC is great for restaurants is a faulty premise here. It is not. Interesting. I was making my observation from the customer's point of view, not the restaurateur's. If I see a Bread and Chocolate or a Cafe Berlin or a Two Quail or a Tunicliff's or yet another coffee shop du jour occupying a choice space, it's only natural to imagine what other, far better restaurant could be there and conclude: "That's a waste of good real estate." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Landrum Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Interesting. I was making my observation from the customer's point of view, not the restaurateur's. If I see a Bread and Chocolate or a Cafe Berlin or a Two Quail or a Tunicliff's or yet another coffee shop du jour occupying a choice space, it's only natural to imagine what other, far better restaurant could be there and conclude: "That's a waste of good real estate." Not to be too Adam Smith about it, but I am of firm belief that every market has exactly the restaurants it wants, needs, is willing to support, and deserves. In many ways, a restaurant is but a direct, unavoidably accurate mirror of the community it serves. In DC it is as much a question of lifestyle as of real estate per se, but the result is the same. But I do agree with your point about the shame of lost opportunities. I was just pointing out that bad restaurants do not happen by accident, but rather are a natural, representative outgrowth of their environment and must actually be willed into existence by the collective will of that environment--else they would not exist. Good restaurants do happen by accident, from an environmental or market point of view, and often involve the will of the restaurateur or chef being in direct conflict with the environment or with community expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hersch Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 every single review except for 1 (of the 12) were either 1 star or 4 star. And the one 2-star review may have been even less positive than Sietsema's. Headline: Disappointing service, mediocre fare. I was just pointing out that bad restaurants do not happen by accident, but rather are a natural, representative outgrowth of their environment and must actually be willed into existence by the collective will of that environment--else they would not exist. It's hard to imagine anyone or any collectivity willing 2 Quail into existence, unless perhaps it was Satan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Escoffier Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 It's hard to imagine anyone or any collectivity willing 2 Quail into existence, unless perhaps it was Satan.And if you happen to believe in AOL and their "dining" guide, you get the following for Two Quail:"The postcards and brochures for Two Quail call it "Washington's Most Romantic Restaurant." ... . The tables are packed in tightly, but the food is strictly first-rate. Two Quail is a fine dining selection for any night, but be sure to keep it in mind for Valentine's Day. Imagine the thrill of having a reservation with your sweetheart at "Washington's Most Romantic Restaurant." -- Jon Bowen" This just makes me want to run right out and make a reservation...Come on gang! Who want's to go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banco Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Not to be too Adam Smith about it, but I am of firm belief that every market has exactly the restaurants it wants, needs, is willing to support, and deserves. In many ways, a restaurant is but a direct, unavoidably accurate mirror of the community it serves. In DC it is as much a question of lifestyle as of real estate per se, but the result is the same.But I do agree with your point about the shame of lost opportunities. I was just pointing out that bad restaurants do not happen by accident, but rather are a natural, representative outgrowth of their environment and must actually be willed into existence by the collective will of that environment--else they would not exist. Good restaurants do happen by accident, from an environmental or market point of view, and often involve the will of the restaurateur or chef being in direct conflict with the environment or with community expectations. Congratulations, Michael, you've managed to join Smith up with Rousseau! Your points are well taken. Traditionally the restaurant landscape on the Hill has suffered in more concentrated fashion from those things nearly all DC restaurants have to contend with: a transient population that makes it difficult for restaurants to form a coterie of "regulars" over the years; a seasonal influx of generally undemanding tourists who tend to crowd out better dining options in some areas; large numbers of interns and staffers with little to spend on fine dining; and perhaps a lack of sensuality and savoir-vivre in a city devoted to a profession where success often depends on cultivating the image of the abstemious, morally upright workaholic. But sometimes the invisible hand is invisible because it simply isn't there. At least on the Hill, I find that there is a critical mass of potential fine-dining consumers who would support better places, but that restaurateurs/investors simply aren't aware of it yet. The success of Sonoma is an indicator of this disjuncture. The previous restaurant in that space was one of those abominations that still litter the Hill, but Sonoma is often booked solid and offers some of the best food for its price level in the city. It's even frequented by some of the seemingly abstemious workaholics and other cohorts mentioned above. On Sundays you'll often find Hill families there with their kids. Much the same could be said for Belga and especially for Montmartre, whose success on the Hill has enabled it to open another locale near Dupont Circle. Market forces only work efficiently under the assumption of good communication and good information. I'm suggesting that those conditions are not met in parts of the DC area, with the result that the restaurants there are far-from-accurate reflections of the communities they serve, the Hill being a prime example. [Don, maybe you should split this off into the “Restaurant Spaces” thread] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLB Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Is this place really this bad? Could a review like this shut down a restaurant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ustreetguy Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 Is this place really this bad? Could a review like this shut down a restaurant? In all honesty, I don't think they'll need to worry about shutting down anytime soon. There are many mediocre restaurants lining the 17th Street strip (with obvious exceptions) that have been open for ages. This place will probably do fine mostly due to its location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeMc Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 In all honesty, I don't think they'll need to worry about shutting down anytime soon. There are many mediocre restaurants lining the 17th Street strip (with obvious exceptions) that have been open for ages. This place will probably do fine mostly due to its location. It's like eating in a whitewashed home depot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSE Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 In all honesty, I don't think they'll need to worry about shutting down anytime soon. There are many mediocre restaurants lining the 17th Street strip (with obvious exceptions) that have been open for ages. This place will probably do fine mostly due to its location.Furthermore, I've been really surprised by the number of people who are totally oblivious to the Post's reviews (among the unwashed mob with which I associate). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demandalicious Posted July 27, 2006 Share Posted July 27, 2006 This place will probably do fine mostly due to its location.I dunno. Any time that I've walked past it - which is, like, every single day - it's been dead. It's unfortunate! I was looking forward to a decent, low-key place in the neighborhood that would be able to deliver the goods when I was craving anything that is a step up from a dive-bar grilled cheese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJono Posted July 28, 2006 Share Posted July 28, 2006 It's like eating in a whitewashed home depot. Yes! That's exactly what it felt like. I couldn't put it into words, but you hit the nail on the head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lydia R Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Maybe I've been eating out too much lately, but I don't see Tom's star(s) in the body of his review - only three stars submitted by one reader in the overview box... Tom's 13 August review of Jimmy's on K Street Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPW Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Maybe I've been eating out too much lately, but I don't see Tom's star(s) in the body of his review - only three stars submitted by one reader in the overview box...Tom's 13 August review of Jimmy's on K Street It's not just you.IIRC, the blurb I heard this morning on WTOP said "one star" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bilrus Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 It's not just you.IIRC, the blurb I heard this morning on WTOP said "one star" And that is exactly how the review reads - barely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami Danny Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 And that is exactly how the review reads - barely. I learned two things from Sietsema's review of Jimmy's: 1) Tom has 'pals', and 2) Jimmy's is a steakhouse (I think). Exactly two sentences on the steaks here. He wrote more about the desserts! And what's with the smug take on being treated well? Like remembering your name is such a crime. And BTW, that manager's business card might come in handy if you have a comment or complaint, no? Didn't read like a one star, because I still don't know how the steaks taste! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crackers Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 The Dining Guide now gives it one star. I still don't know how the steaks taste! Sietsema said the filet mignon had a "muted taste" and the cowboy rib-eye had a "pleasant chew and beefy appeal." In this highly competitive meat market, I read into the review that he thinks the steaks are nothing special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami Danny Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 The Dining Guide now gives it one star. Sietsema said the filet mignon had a "muted taste" and the cowboy rib-eye had a "pleasant chew and beefy appeal." In this highly competitive meat market, I read into the review that he thinks the steaks are nothing special. Yes-I read into the review that Sietsema didn't spend enough time or effort on it. Another lackluster performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Cunningham Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 Sietsema is enamored with certain chefs in Dc. One especially who has 4 restaurants. This chef, while excellent, could serve shit on a plate, topped with a deat rat, and tom would give the dish 4 stars-5 if the hostess was attractive. I am not saying that he is not a passable critic as I personally tend to agree with him at times, just that his opinion is just that: one person's view. Please take it with a grain of salt and just like movies, go see for yourself, because only you can decide. His annoying "love the chat" groupies and less than stellar writing, makes me want to buy him a ticket on Jet Blue back to San Fran-where eveything in roses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 x > y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barbara Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 First was the complaint that he gave most places two stars. Now, for two weeks in a row, he has written about places that didn't even rate THAT. Personally, I am glad for the information. What we don't know, however, is the content of the emails he gets and the questions/comments which aren't published on his weekly chat. If some "4 star chef" was indeed serving up shit, I'll bet you he has heard about it. The bottom line for Jimmy's is that if you are going to open up another steak house, it had better be damn good from soup to nuts, particularly at these kinds of price points. The glad-handing by the staff isn't going to make up for mediocre, over-priced food. And, he is absolutely right about that. You can get better food at both of Landrum's places at half the price. If the corporate masters of these steak joints don't like that, well TOUGH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Cunningham Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 First was the complaint that he gave most places two stars. Now, for two weeks in a row, he has written about places that didn't even rate THAT. Personally, I am glad for the information. What we don't know, however, is the content of the emails he gets and the questions/comments which aren't published on his weekly chat. If some "4 star chef" was indeed serving up shit, I'll bet you he has heard about it.The bottom line for Jimmy's is that if you are going to open up another steak house, it had better be damn good from soup to nuts, particularly at these kinds of price points. The glad-handing by the staff isn't going to make up for mediocre, over-priced food. And, he is absolutely right about that. You can get better food at both of Landrum's places at half the price. If the corporate masters of these steak joints don't like that, well TOUGH. On a separate note I am not specifically refering to his review of Jimmy's. I know where I go for steak, but I still might try it sometime and decide for myself. Have you been to Jimmys, experienced it for yourself, or do you plan on ever going? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barbara Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 Have you been to Jimmys, experienced it for yourself, or do you plan on ever going?Life is too short, and my pockets aren't deep enough. Go. Enjoy. Report back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami Danny Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 The bottom line for Jimmy's is that if you are going to open up another steak house, it had better be damn good from soup to nuts, particularly at these kinds of price points. The glad-handing by the staff isn't going to make up for mediocre, over-priced food. And, he is absolutely right about that. You can get better food at both of Landrum's places at half the price. If the corporate masters of these steak joints don't like that, well TOUGH. Why is it 'glad-handing' here, but 'attentiveness' elsewhere? What you are posting ('mediocre, overpriced') is NOT what Tom is saying, but your interpretation of Tom's review-this makes my point exactly! Tom's review is utterly without merit, i.e., I learned nothing about Jimmy's steaks. He spends more time on the sides and twice as much space on the desserts. IF THE RESTAURANT SUCKS, SAY SO! The bottom line for Tom, is that this review is superficial and a waste of space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heather Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 Oh I don't know. Tom's review gave me plenty of information, enought that I'm not inspired to run to the phone to make a res. Let's see...The best steaks are the strip and the cowboy, the halibut is "satisfying", the sides need work, clam chowder was tasty, the caesar has institutional dressing, a couple desserts are worth ordering, the price point is about double Ray's the Steaks, and the service sounds extremely familiar. I did think it was odd that the drinks and wine list didn't rate a mention. (MD, I'm not a huge Sietsema fan, but you sound like a man with a slight grudge. Has Sietsema reviewed your establishment? And where is it anyway?) Oh, and there is a yawning chasm between "glad-handing" and attentive service. I suspect most people on the board know when the line is crossed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami Danny Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 Oh I don't know. Tom's review gave me plenty of information, enought that I'm not inspired to run to the phone to make a res. Let's see...The best steaks are the strip and the cowboy, the halibut is "satisfying", the sides need work, clam chowder was tasty, the caesar has institutional dressing, a couple desserts are worth ordering, the price point is about double Ray's the Steaks, and the service sounds extremely familiar.I did think it was odd that the drinks and wine list didn't rate a mention. (MD, I'm not a huge Sietsema fan, but you sound like a man with a slight grudge. Has Sietsema reviewed your establishment? And where is it anyway?) Oh, and there is a yawning chasm between "glad-handing" and attentive service. I suspect most people on the board know when the line is crossed. Sietsema's prejudices are on full view here. I've exchanged emails with him in the past, he seems like a decent guy, and I have no qualms with most of what he says. However, the dining review, once a week, should contain more than inferences (your interpretations). BTW, not everyone wants to (or is able to) schlep to the suburbs for dinner. One might be willing to pay more for a convenient place. That is another reason why the review was disappointing-I read Tom's reviews because I might actually go to places he writes about. I'm not reading them for sport-I read CounterCulture for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanishka Posted August 13, 2006 Share Posted August 13, 2006 Sietsema's prejudices are on full view here. I've exchanged emails with him in the past, he seems like a decent guy, and I have no qualms with most of what he says. However, the dining review, once a week, should contain more than inferences (your interpretations). BTW, not everyone wants to (or is able to) schlep to the suburbs for dinner. One might be willing to pay more for a convenient place. That is another reason why the review was disappointing-I read Tom's reviews because I might actually go to places he writes about. I'm not reading them for sport-I read CounterCulture for that. You are not answering the main question, MD. You are clearly in the business. Where is your restaurant? What is your role? Most pros here have their affiliations openly stated in their signatures. It's a courtesy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami Danny Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 You are not answering the main question, MD. You are clearly in the business. Where is your restaurant? What is your role? Most pros here have their affiliations openly stated in their signatures. It's a courtesy. My life is an open book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanielK Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 BTW, not everyone wants to (or is able to) schlep to the suburbs for dinner. I'd be willing to bet that a substantial majority of the Post's regular readers consider DOWNTOWN a schlep for dinner, and are more likely to go to a place in the suburbs regularly. I thought the review was immensely clear, and his one-star review says it all: there are some things worth eating there, but it's not worth driving across town for. For a steakhouse, with lots of competition within walking distance or a short drive (as he mentions), that just doesn't cut it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacques Gastreaux Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 Miami Danny, how many times have you dined at Jimmy's, what have you had, and how does it compare? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan7147 Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 You are not answering the main question, MD. You are clearly in the business. Where is your restaurant? What is your role? Most pros here have their affiliations openly stated in their signatures. It's a courtesy. He is a co-owner of a little tapas/wine bar/Wine store in Miami near the design district called Stop Miami. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miami Danny Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 Miami Danny, how many times have you dined at Jimmy's, what have you had, and how does it compare? I was commenting on TS's glossy review, not the restaurant itself. I really don't give a crap about Jimmy's, I hope they succeed, and I hope Tom keeps reviewing for the Post so I know I'll always have something to rant about. BTW, as a courtesy, I have always had my real name, picture, and pertinent affiliations listed in my Control Panel-in this and any other forum. It's a click away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertyy Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 I'm with Danny on this one (though perhaps a trifle less vehemently). There's no mention of beverage service and two sentences on steaks--one of which was "Jimmy's boneless filet mignon is better for its tender texture than its muted taste"; isn't that true of every filet on earth?? The language of this review mirrors that of nearly every other in recent memory, and I thought the one star was the only clear indication of Jimmy's quality--or lack thereof. I am delighted, though, that Tom's gotten out of the two-star rut! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DLB Posted August 14, 2006 Share Posted August 14, 2006 You really have to take these reviews with a grain of salt. It's just one persons opinion, nothing more nothing less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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