Help Needed--Landscaper to fix my shady, muddy yard

[PollyG]

I have a house with a southern exposure and full growth forest in most of the back. We have typical red Virginia clay with very little top soil on our unwooded portion of the back yard, which is shaded most of the day by the house and the trees. I need a landscaper who can come up with a long-term solution to get grass or another year-round cover back here again without a bunch of chemicals. Heavy fertilizers, herbicides, etc. are not an acceptable option for us.

A landscaper who doesn't look at the neighborhood and quote astronomical fees would also be a big plus. We are open to installing sprinklers in recognition of our inability to stick to a regular watering schedule.

[thistle]

Polly, I hear you, I have the same sort of back yard, heavily shaded w/ mature trees both in the yard & around the perimeter. I've worked at a garden center & I'll be honest-there isn't a landscaper around who can give you grass, whether or not you put in irrigation. You might be able to manage some shade-tolerant grass or moss, but it won't be picture perfect. I did manage, after a couple of years & a lot of work, to build up my plantings at the edges of the yard, but then I got 2 puppies...I've resigned myself to the fact that unless I take out at least 4 more trees (but it'll take ages for the roots to decompose), bring in truckloads of topsoil, & get rid of the dogs (not going to happen), my yard will be suboptimal for the next few years.

I wish you luck, but if you come across someone who will tell you otherwise, get it in writing...

[porcupine]

When I was a Master Gardener I got this question alot, and it drove me nuts, because nobody wanted to believe the answer.

Turfgrass likes light alkaline soil and full sunlight. Your heavy mid-Atlantic piedmont soil is probably rather acidic. That can be corrected with a small amount of chemicals (to adjust the pH) and a whole lot of compost and manual labor. However, so long as you have tree-root interference and shade, all the soil correction in the world won't do any good.

If you're dead-set on having a lawn (which, by the way, is the most expensive, labor-intensive, and environmentally damaging plant cover you can have), then you need to hire an arborist to selectively remove trees and thin the canopy of what remains. Then you need to dig up the planting area and mix in the compost, etc. (I'd recommend using a hydraulic tiller.) That's assuming you don't have too much tree root competition from, say, willows or Norway maples. Then you need to seed or sod with the right cultivar (I'm no longer current with that, but there are many turfgrass species and cultivars out there; obviously you'd want one that is shade-tolerant).

And then, if you want it to look like a slice of picture-perfect Americana year after year, you need to fertilize.

Turfgrass is not benign and is not well suited to growing in this region without a lot of help. The area you describe would be perfect for a moss garden, though.

There are plenty of good reasons to want a nice lawn, so I'm not going to try to talk you out of it.

If you're open to having another sort of groundcover, I'd recommend looking into that before cutting into your nice forest.

As far as recommending landscapers, after years of being a MG I've come to loathe most of them. The sight of tree-base mulch-volcanoes every spring makes me want to scream. There's one small company who I've worked with since about 1997. The owner is smart and actually follows good horticultural practices. You know what else? He won't do turfgrass.

But it's a place to start, maybe. Garth Seely, Gardens by Garth. As far as I know he doesn't have a website, but his other organization does. Contact info is the same. LAND Good luck, and post some follow-ups for us avid gardeners.

[PollyG]

When I was a Master Gardener I got this question alot, and it drove me nuts, because nobody wanted to believe the answer.

. . .

If you're open to having another sort of groundcover, I'd recommend looking into that before cutting into your nice forest.

As far as recommending landscapers, after years of being a MG I've come to loathe most of them. The sight of tree-base mulch-volcanoes every spring makes me want to scream. There's one small company who I've worked with since about 1997. The owner is smart and actually follows good horticultural practices. You know what else? He won't do turfgrass.

But it's a place to start, maybe. Garth Seely, Gardens by Garth. As far as I know he doesn't have a website, but his other organization does. Contact info is the same. LAND Good luck, and post some follow-ups for us avid gardeners.

We are absolutely open to another type of groundcover, as long as it is not going to invade the yards of the neighbors. Cutting the trees is not an option. Unlike most of the neighbors, I actually do respect the conservation easement that covers most of the yard. Even without it, I'd really hesitate to take out a healthy mature tree. I am open to anything that does not involve a lot of chemicals (lime and other soil ph changers are not going to be an issue, pesticides/herbicides would be) and leaves me without the horrible mud pits that are not fun for the dogs or us. Wear and tear by the dogs is actually not that much of an issue--we can fence to keep them off of baby seeding areas, and after that, they use the yard for pooping and little else. Poop is removed 2x weekly.

[DrXmus]

What you are asking for is what my wife does, albeit she's a consultant only but will help you coordinate with the company that is doing the work. Her business is called Nativescapes and she specializes in placing native plants. Shady spaces and clay soil is what many of these plants want and need and trying to put plants where they don't belong is why landscapes need fertilizing, aerating and irrigation systems. None of this is needed when using native plants that actually want to live in your yard. She won't ask you to cut down any trees. She'll work with you to include the types of plants you like, but she'll try her best to place native plants, which are sometimes even better than what you thought could go into the space.

Her web site is Nativescapes.net.

[porcupine]

Heck, I'm tempted to call Mrs DrXmus myself! In the meantime, there's some good info through the Universtiy of Maryland Home and Garden Information Center HGIC . Scroll down to Landscape Plant Information and look for Ground Covers. The info on this site is often very specific to Maryland, but unless you live way out in the VA exurbs most of it will be applicable. UVA also has an excellent Extension Service but I'm not familiar with the specifics of their program so I don't know where to send you.

[DrXmus]

When I was a Master Gardener I got this question alot, and it drove me nuts, because nobody wanted to believe the answer.

Turfgrass likes light alkaline soil and full sunlight. Your heavy mid-Atlantic piedmont soil is probably rather acidic. That can be corrected with a small amount of chemicals (to adjust the pH) and a whole lot of compost and manual labor. However, so long as you have tree-root interference and shade, all the soil correction in the world won't do any good.

If you're dead-set on having a lawn (which, by the way, is the most expensive, labor-intensive, and environmentally damaging plant cover you can have), then you need to hire an arborist to selectively remove trees and thin the canopy of what remains. Then you need to dig up the planting area and mix in the compost, etc. (I'd recommend using a hydraulic tiller.) That's assuming you don't have too much tree root competition from, say, willows or Norway maples. Then you need to seed or sod with the right cultivar (I'm no longer current with that, but there are many turfgrass species and cultivars out there; obviously you'd want one that is shade-tolerant).

And then, if you want it to look like a slice of picture-perfect Americana year after year, you need to fertilize.

Turfgrass is not benign and is not well suited to growing in this region without a lot of help. The area you describe would be perfect for a moss garden, though.

There are plenty of good reasons to want a nice lawn, so I'm not going to try to talk you out of it.

If you're open to having another sort of groundcover, I'd recommend looking into that before cutting into your nice forest.

As far as recommending landscapers, after years of being a MG I've come to loathe most of them. The sight of tree-base mulch-volcanoes every spring makes me want to scream. There's one small company who I've worked with since about 1997. The owner is smart and actually follows good horticultural practices. You know what else? He won't do turfgrass.

But it's a place to start, maybe. Garth Seely, Gardens by Garth. As far as I know he doesn't have a website, but his other organization does. Contact info is the same. LAND Good luck, and post some follow-ups for us avid gardeners.

Well-said! We haven't had a lawn in years! No mowing. No fertiziling. No pesticides. On the "pro" side - we have Monarchs, bluebirds, three types of woodpeckers, Pipevine swallowtail butterflies, Spicebush swallowtail butterflies, tree frogs, foxes, raccoons and something colorful and blooming most of the year!

[PollyG]

What you are asking for is what my wife does, albeit she's a consultant only but will help you coordinate with the company that is doing the work. Her business is called Nativescapes and she specializes in placing native plants. Shady spaces and clay soil is what many of these plants want and need and trying to put plants where they don't belong is why landscapes need fertilizing, aerating and irrigation systems. None of this is needed when using native plants that actually want to live in your yard. She won't ask you to cut down any trees. She'll work with you to include the types of plants you like, but she'll try her best to place native plants, which are sometimes even better than what you thought could go into the space.

Her web site is Nativescapes.net.

Thank you! Sounds perfect.