Here's Everything I've Fought Against For Almost Eight Years

[DonRocks]

I'll gladly team up with all restaurants and tell *all* of these people to get over themselves.

"Seeking Preferential Treatment with the Flash of a Card is Wrong"

Hope you like the taste of spit, Mr. Newman.

[darkstar965]

I'll gladly team up with all restaurants and tell *all* of these people to get over themselves.

"Seeking Preferential Treatment with the Flash of a Card is Wrong"

Almost not even worth commenting on because it's so absurd. All you have to know is captured thusly:

So he's come up with his own business, a Manhattan Beach company called ReviewerCard that issues IDs to prolific online reviewers to help them get better service than the rest of us.

Granted, that's not how Newman, 35, would put it. He sees ReviewerCard as a way to enhance the relationship between amateur reviewers and the hotels or restaurants they visit.

"It's not a threat," Newman insisted. "It's a way to get the service you deserve."

OK, let's back up a bit.

Newman describes himself as a lifelong entrepreneur. He said he started his first business, a carwash, at age 14. He later established hockey camps. In the 1990s, he launched a social-networking site.

"I don't want to say it was the first Facebook, but it was," Newman said. "Even though it bombed."

I'd be annoyed if this wasn't downright funny in its absurdity and cluelessness. Bold facing is mine--the lines I found most amusing. Clearly the LA Times writer had some disdain for his subject. How much you want to bet this company will bomb and he'll say it was the first Groupon in a later interview?

[SeanMike]

Well, given the title of the article, I think the disdain was clear.

On Twitter, Wayne Curtis (https://twitter.com/waynecurtis) has some interesting breakdowns of Mr. Newman's "reviews".

[monavano]

This (douche)card doesn't celebrate the likes of the relationship DR'ers have with restaurants, chefs, producers, farmers etc, it exploits them. I mean, "you could look at it that way".

[DonRocks]

This (douche)card doesn't celebrate the likes of the relationship DR'ers have with restaurants, chefs, producers, farmers etc, it exploits them. I mean, "you could look at it that way".

I removed my comment about the dr.com events entirely; I don't want to even be thought of in the same week as this douche - who *doesn't care about anyone but himself*.

[brian]

The guy running this is running a scam - charging $100 for a meaningless card people won't recognize or care about. He knows it's worthless but making the entire concept as objectionable as he has and then sending cards to the press is accomplishing exactly what he wants it to, he's getting publicity for it and a few suckers will read about it and get cards. 99.999% of people know it's worthless and gross, but doing stories on it or even linking to it helps get it attention and put it in front of that .001% who might fall for something like this.

[DonRocks]

The guy running this is running a scam - charging $100 for a meaningless card people won't recognize or care about. He knows it's worthless but making the entire concept as objectionable as he has and then sending cards to the press is accomplishing exactly what he wants it to, he's getting publicity for it and a few suckers will read about it and get cards. 99.999% of people know it's worthless and gross, but doing stories on it or even linking to it helps get it attention and put it in front of that .001% who might fall for something like this.

You're right, of course, and it would be best if he languished in obscurity. Still, that's why I tagged his name - for future reference.

[monavano]

I think he should have called it the "Don't You Know Who I Americanexpresspoorman'sblackcard?" card.

[dcs]

The guy running this is running a scam - charging $100 for a meaningless card people won't recognize or care about. He knows it's worthless but making the entire concept as objectionable as he has and then sending cards to the press is accomplishing exactly what he wants it to, he's getting publicity for it and a few suckers will read about it and get cards. 99.999% of people know it's worthless and gross, but doing stories on it or even linking to it helps get it attention and put it in front of that .001% who might fall for something like this.

I am pretty sure I can get a box of 250 business cards printed with the same message for about $10. Would you trust the opinion of someone who would pay $100 for one card?

[jayandstacey]

I think he should have called it the "Don't You Know Who I Americanexpresspoorman'sblackcard?" card.

I dunno, I see this as kind of harmless.

Before y'all jump on me - consider that anyone who buys such a card is pretty wrapped up in their sense of themselves and their entitlement. NYC seems to have a healthy amount of such people and they certainly exist other places.

BUT>>>>>

This is a two-way street. There seem to be plenty of places that offer favorable treatment - to known critics, to celebrities, etc. This card is a kind of lame attempt to join that crowd. So is it the card (holder)'s fault? or the places that offer lavish treatment for VIPs?

The optimist in me thinks that in the long run, the successful places will be those, like Dino's, that treat schleps like me with as much charm and service as (seemingly) anyone else. My inclination (as with most of you) is that I'd want to avoid places that would cower to such a card as much as I'd want to avoid those bearing one.

There's a whole world out there of velvet ropes and doorman tips; VIP lounges, champagne and running tabs. That world has some who feed into it and some who feed from it. This guy is on the taking side and he's probably just fine with this kind of attention. It highlights how "his people" are different from the commoners who sneer at such things.

[jayandstacey]

One other note - this appeals to the most basic of human wants, the want to feel appreciated.

I imagine that some people write reviews with an eye toward becoming the "powerful critic" who is feared city-wide. They probably know that's a pipe dream but yearn to have their efforts recognized. Yet it never really happens - why would it?

So they buy into what may become a standardized way to telegraph their intentions. "Hey, I'm going to post my experience. I'm not so concerned about helping others (as reviews were originally intended to do) but want to jump right to the goodies - the critic-king if you will. So here's my card, at a minimum know that I'm a critic, as you are the one most likely to care, if anyone does."

Which I'm sure gets to Don's hatred of this...the hostage aspect of it. It will fail under that weight.

This guy will make a few $1000, go back to marketing more dental offices and look for his next pot of gold. He invented Facebook after all

[DaveO]

Reviews in general are an amazingly controversial web issue with endless side issues: Consider:

• fake positive reviews by the business
• fake negative reviews by competitors
• reviews for pay
• reviews meant to destroy a business in the most vile way
• reviews volume simply to up your ranking in search engines
• reviews used for spite and like this guy wants to use them
• reviews and threats made to take down a business for political purposes
• reviews artificially "crafted" by a review management/marketing team to sell your business based on faked reviews

So many controversial issues connected to reviews.

BTW: One of the big elements in internet dental marketing is the process of review solicitation, management, and presentation of those reviews.

The whole review thing is a big can of worms. I do a lot of local Search engine optimizing for smb's. pretty active in it. Somewhat knowledgeable. I gave a recent presentation on a variety of topics including general stuff, some technical stuff and reviews. There were plenty of people with enough technical experience there to grasp on the technical aspects. But the thing that raised a lot of controversy, conversation, and raised people's blood pressure was reviews. Reviews make people NUTS.

[fuzzy510]

BUT>>>>>

This is a two-way street. There seem to be plenty of places that offer favorable treatment - to known critics, to celebrities, etc. This card is a kind of lame attempt to join that crowd. So is it the card (holder)'s fault? or the places that offer lavish treatment for VIPs?

I'd say it's completely the cardholder's fault for trying to strong-arm their way into VIP status on the basis of "I write lots of internet reviews!"

All this does is water down the value of an already questionably valuable service. Anybody who uses these cards falls into one of two camps:

-Those who would accurately assess a business regardless of any preferential treatment, and are just using the card as a way to leverage extras from said business, or

-Those who will only give top reviews to businesses who offer preferential treatment, and will dock stars from an otherwise worthy establishment when they don't get it.

The people in the first group strike me as being exceptionally cheap and petty. The people in the second group are worse, because they are doing a disservice to everyone involved: the business who doesn't get the credit they deserve because they won't play ball, the review service that's suddenly rating businesses on other criteria that are totally secondary to how good of a business they are, and the customers who skip out on quality establishments simply because they don't hand out bribes.

I'm not sure that there's ANYBODY who wants this to catch on.

[Waitman]

I know I'm going to get my knuckles rapped for bringing up a grim incident but...

It appears some of us are all upset that a diner will flash an (admittedly obxious) card with an implied threat/promise of a review on Yelp or elsewhere, which will likely turn to some extent on the level of obsequiousness the restaurateur/victim shows in response to the card.

I'd say it's completely the cardholder's fault for trying to strong-arm their way into VIP status on the basis of "I write lots of internet reviews!"

And yet, when Don offers to intervene on behalf of a Rockwellian with some allied maitre d', an intervention that contains exactly the same threat/promise, it's all good and kind and we're not extortionists or assholes, just a "community."

Preferential treatment based on one's on-line presence is either wrong, or its not, and the vehicle through which this preference is obtained -- whether through a plastic card or a discreet phone call from an influential webmaster/critic or an announcement up front that you intend to post on DR (or Yelp!) -- is pretty secondary to the larger issue, I think.

[RWBooneJr]

And yet, when Don offers to intervene on behalf of a Rockwellian with some allied maitre d', an intervention that contains exactly the same threat/promise, it's all good and kind and we're not extortionists or assholes, just a "community."

There's no need to rap knuckles. You clearly do not know Don Rockwell, nor do you know the nature of his relationships within the industry. No one that did would equate the farce at issue with anything Don has ever done.

[DonRocks]

And yet, when Don offers to intervene on behalf of a Rockwellian with some allied maitre d', an intervention that contains exactly the same threat/promise, it's all good and kind and we're not extortionists or assholes, just a "community."

I assume you're talking about the time I told Eric Ziebold (one of my best friends, whose wedding ceremony I performed in France) you were coming to CityZen for a special occasion, and out of the kindness of his heart, he sent you an extra course, extra wine, and Parker House rolls. You didn't have to take them, you know.

[Bart]

The wonderful Ruth Bourdain has a competing card availble:

Introducing the DoucheCard

You may have heard of the ReviewerCard, but unfortunately it costs $100 to join. That’s why I’m introducing the DoucheCard, a first-of-its-kind FREE membership card for aspiring amuse douches and douchebaguettes.

Just print out this page, clip-and-save the card, and use it at your favorite eateries.

Here’s how it works:

1. Display DoucheCard at restaurant.

2. Receive looks of disgust from your waiter.

3. Enjoy complimentary pee in your food courtesy of the chef.

4. Destroy any shred of rapport with restaurant.

5. Return home in shame.

http://www.comfortmewithoffal.com/post/41276851167/introducing-the-douchecard

[Waitman]

There's no need to rap knuckles. You clearly do not know Don Rockwell, nor do you know the nature of his relationships within the industry. No one that did would equate the farce at issue with anything Don has ever done.

I think I might know Don better than you think.

it's not that he's evil or manipulative, I think that there's an inherent conflict here: If you're his position and pulling strings, however well intended, it's pressuring the restaurant. And you have officially gone down a slippery slope -- you have made using one's position as a "reviewer" a legitimate bargaining tool for every schmuck that wants to drop names. I know Don is a great guy. But think actions like that compromise the website and encourage objectionable behavior.

I assume you're talking about the time I told Eric Ziebold (one of my best friends, whose wedding ceremony I performed in France) you were coming to CityZen for a special occasion, and out of the kindness of his heart, he sent you an extra course, extra wine, and Parker House rolls. You didn't have to take them, you know.

I have no doubt you did this but I can't for the life of me remember when -- Eric and his team have been extraordinary gracious to Stephanie, Dylan, Nora and me many times, including --recently -- a pair of the worst days of my life. But, now that I discover that it's all your influence and none of my charm (Stephanie's, really), I will write a check for the wine and slink over to The Source or something for my next big night out.

At any rate, I do know that you and Eric are close, and, as I recall you'd dined on cassoulet chez moi before I ever went to CZ, which suggests a somewhat organic triangle here, for whatever that is worth. You also did not post (until now) about whatever strings you pulled on my behalf, and I never wrote knowingly about a meal that you influenced.

This whole thing is not to imply evil intent. Just to say that you are a semi-public figure and you harm both the appearance and reality of objectivity when you wield your influence on behalf of members.

[Rovers2000]

For me, it comes down to something a bit different and maybe outside of where Waitman was going:

Society now has this sense of entitlement, particularly in how it relates to all things the interweb, that a restaurant "owes" them something. This card is trying to capitalize on that by playing off the sense that Joe Moron can leave a rant on yelp (founded or not) or their random blog thus the restaurant owes them freebies or what have you. Not only would the user of the card come across as a complete douche but it would be disrespectful to the restaurant.

I've never gotten that sense of entitlement from many of the participants on this site (I'm sure they exist).

[ol_ironstomach]

I've never gotten that sense of entitlement from many of the participants on this site (I'm sure they exist).

That is, in fact, something that many of the people who post here have carefully sought to avoid for years. We're just, you know, regular diners.

[jayandstacey]

That is, in fact, something that many of the people who post here have carefully sought to avoid for years. We're just, you know, regular diners.

Yes but at the same time, there's ongoing desire for specials (mention DR.com and get....) and the want of restaurants to have us join in (wear a crazy Christmas sweater and we'll recognize you...)

That's the slippery slope I was pointing to - that it takes two to tango and that we all sometimes play that game along with the restaurant. No one would ever pay for the card unless these things happened in the restaurant business. Sometimes two tables can order the same thing and get two different experiences/checks. Not all restaurants are like this. And I'm not saying the card isn't absurd, as it is. But what circumstance led to the invention of such a thing?

Would such a card work in home depot / lowes? No. They don't really care about reviews, they run a different kind of business. But they WILL treat a contractor (heavy buyer) a bit differently than a DIY'er. So I bet that somewhere out there is someone advising how to 'work the system' and get the Lowes contractor treatment.

It isn't right but it is a child of the times.

[darkstar965]

From a pan-industry perspective, it's both normal and effective business practice to discriminate in favor of a business' 'best customers' at the expense of 'less attractive' customers. That's the basis of segmentation.

The devil is in the details of how a business discriminates and how it defines 'best'

I don't think restaurants are any different than banks, airlines or machine parts manufacturers in this way.

The nature of discrimination can take the form of discounts, preferential pricing, access to supplier executives/owners or other special bonuses or benefits.

Usually, best is defined as those customers who account for the most revenue, most profit or have some other importance to the business. They should be a small minority of all customers.

Again, this is normal and widespread business practice, whatever the industry.

For that reason, I think the issue with the card business is that the 'entrepreneur' (a generous label) is trying to convince customers they can create importance where none would otherwise exist. That's ridiculous whatever the impact a bad yelp posting might have.

Examples from across industries:

- I get premier status on an airline if I fly enough and spend enough.

- Might get backstage passes for a concert if the promoter was my college roommate.

- I might pay 15% less for my widgets because I buy 50% more volume than all but 10% of my supplier's customers.

- Free WiFi in a hotel room because I travel too much.

- Invited to meet with the CEO of a major software company because I'm a tech journalist.

- Ted Leonsis' kids get floor seats at Wizards games. He owns the team.

- A buyer from an industry under-represented in the supplier's customer base gets invited to join a 'top tier customer advisory council' that includes a paid trip to Bora Bora for annual "meetings."

- A sales rep has an 'entertainment' budget and uses it only with her most attractive prospects deemed most likely to buy or who are most important to keep happy.

- And, maybe Waitman got especially nice treatment at one of DC's best restaurants thanks to Don's close relationship with a chef.

All fine. All logical reasons. All earned or at least logically explainable. All sensible (and, indeed, smart) business practice.

Merely having a piece of plastic is not a reason. It's unearned. It's akin to hanging a sign around one's neck that says "I'm a famous movie star" when one is not. It makes little sense. It's obnoxious. It should prompt uproarious laughter from the restaurant...and then the boot.

Most of all, it's a (very) stupid business model.

[FunnyJohn]

I think Waitman has offered an interesting point in his first post above. As a counter, I would say there is a difference between someone using his avocation as an internet reviewer to leverage special treatment and Don using a relationship with chefs and owners of so many establishments around here that he has cultivated by essentially being a straight-shooter, calling it like he sees it reviewer, and by providing others the opportunity to do the same, to offer others a service that does not necessarily promise that they -- or he -- will receive special treatment. In other words, Don is a symbiote while Newman is a parasite.

[edited to add: I only linked to the pic of a symbiote because I thought it was awesome. No further correspondence between Don and the comic-book character is intended. ]

[RWBooneJr]

I think I might know Don better than you think.

I'm more aware of your relationship with Don than you think. There's a reason that the word below the handsome picture to the left of this message isn't "Members." I merely conclude that, despite your long-standing relationship with Don, you must know little about him or his relationships with people in the restaurant business. I couldn't fathom Don ever allowing his "position as a 'reviewer'" to become a "bargaining tool for every schmuck that wants to drop names." I also don't see Don ever allowing personal relationships to "compromise the website and encourage objectionable behavior." The Don I know is as FunnyJohn describes: "a straight-shooter, calling it like he sees it reviewer" who "provid[es] others the opportunity to do the same" through "a service that does not necessarily promise that they -- or he -- will recieve special treatment." The difference between ReviewerCard or any of the behavior you describe and Don Rockwell is integrity. Your argument is fatally flawed (and personally offensive), because it presumes that Don -- my friend -- has none.

[Pat]

People can use Don's name and try to throw around their weight (or its weight) without Don's necessarily being aware of it or endorsing it.

[mdt]

People can use Don's name and try to throw around their weight (or its weight) without Don's necessarily being aware of it or endorsing it.

And IIRC it has happened in the past...

[darkstar965]

I think Waitman has offered an interesting point in his first post above. As a counter, I would say there is a difference between someone using his avocation as an internet reviewer to leverage special treatment and Don using a relationship with chefs and owners of so many establishments around here that he has cultivated by [developing a real relationship the normal way]. In other words, Don is a symbiote while Newman is a parasite.

Until Invision innovates more to allow likes for quotes and not whole posts, I'll just say "+1" on the above. It's the essence of the entire thread in my view. Special/unique relationships of all kinds often get rewarded. Ethics and values are the only real barrier against exploiting that reality.

I'm more aware of your relationship with Don than you think. ... I merely conclude that, despite your long-standing relationship with Don, you must know little about him or his relationships with people in the restaurant business.

Wait a minute! I met Don at a picnic once! And I also met Tom S once--though I didn't know it was Tom S when I met him. Yes, joking with those statements a bit. Doesn't matter so much here other than it being about one's ability, which presumably both Waitman and RW Boone have, to assess Msgr Rockwell's ethics and values and determine that they meet a reasonable person's bar. I think he (Don) does just based on what I read; how he moderates this community. So more than happy to have you guys, with real history and first-hand knowledge, agree with me. Thank you.

All the above is a bit of navel gazing though.

The topic was about the card idea. The card is a literally comic (in its futility) idea to try and shake down restaurants. It's a very dumb idea to make money. And the people who buy and try to use the card will look dumb, funny and sad all at once.

Better than the Douche Card idea would be a new business that would make "GOOMR--YAAI" ('Get Out Of My Restaurant--You Are An Idiot') cards that chef/owners could flash in response; kind of like the coins used in military and government circles. Of course, the 'entrepreneur' behind those cards would have to give 'em away for free. But okay if they get a free app sent out.

Quoting myself from above:

Merely having a piece of plastic is not a reason [to expect special treatment of any kind]. It's unearned. It's akin to hanging a sign around one's neck that says "I'm a famous movie star" when one is not. It makes little sense. It's obnoxious. It should prompt uproarious laughter from the restaurant...and then the boot.

Most of all, it's a (very) stupid business model.

[jayandstacey]

Most of all, it's a (very) stupid business model.

Unless he makes money at it, in which case it may be brilliant. Others have done well on stupider business models

[DonRocks]

I have no doubt you did this but I can't for the life of me remember when -- Eric and his team have been extraordinary gracious to Stephanie, Dylan, Nora and me many times, including --recently -- a pair of the worst days of my life. But, now that I discover that it's all your influence and none of my charm (Stephanie's, really), I will write a check for the wine and slink over to The Source or something for my next big night out.

Charles,

You can't remember when because I never told you I did it.

This was shortly after you took over from me as DC & DelMarVa Forum Host on eGullet. We were in the midst of some exchanges where I was trying to coach you (not that you needed my coaching), and you mentioned to me that you were going to CityZen to celebrate a special occasion (I don't remember what it was - a birthday, or an anniversary, or something similar).

I called Eric the day you went, and let him know that Busboy - my replacement at eGullet - was coming in to celebrate a special occasion, and that you were a good friend of mine. Nothing else needed to be said. Eric, entirely on his own volition, chose to show you the courtesies that you deserved - not to curry favor, but to make you feel welcome on what was a special occasion for you - it was one industry member showing respect to another. I didn't ask him to do anything, and he didn't mention that he was going to do anything, but I knew that at the minimum, he would come to your table and welcome you in person. There was no discussion of "free food" or "giveaways" or "reviews," nor was there any covert secrecy (I'm certain that he chatted with you about your new position at eGullet) - it was just a friend (Eric), showing genuine respect to an important person in the industry (you). You wrote me the next day, and told me that you had a wonderful time and left a huge tip.

Today, January 24th, is precisely three months since the passing of your dear wife, Stephanie. About a month ago, you had me over for dinner, and we toasted her life over a bottle of 1996 Lanson. There was one person at the dinner table weeping over her death: me. I had not openly wept, about anything, in probably a year or more. It brought back a torrent of memories about my Karen, and despite me thinking I was "comforting a friend" by coming over and making sure you were okay, it turns out that I was the one who needed comfort; you were rock solid, and ended up comforting me when I broke down.

You'll be there again, one day in the future, comforting a friend, or perhaps being comforted by one, just as it was a month ago. I can tell you from first-hand experience that you'll never be able to predict what's going to happen in terms of the timeline of your survival, coping, and eventual recovery (not so much "recovery" as "incorporation of the loss").

Thank you for your friendship and for your invaluable contributions here. As you know, the Widow Hotline is open to you 24/7/365. We are both lifetime members of The Suck Club, and now is your time to let your elders take care of you; your time to take care of others will come at a later date because we are all eternally committed to paying it forward.

Kind regards,

Don