DonRocks Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Trying to pigeonhole Againn, I'm wondering if 10th & NY Ave is considered "Downtown." This area to the west of Mount Vernon Square has always perplexed me. Five years ago, I think Corduroy (12th and K) was very fringe in terms of being considered downtown, but now it's probably not wrong to think it is. But does downtown now go east of 12th street? Are there any official maps or borders? Unofficial maps? I've looked for awhile, and nothing seems definitive. (We could have the same discussion about S. Dupont and Downtown as well - where does one end and the other begin?) (I'll probably delete this thread later, so please just make the answers as poorly written and dashed-off as you'd like, and maybe consider them like you would a PM to me) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monavano Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Trying to pigeonhole Againn, I'm wondering if 10th & NY Ave is considered "Downtown." This area to the west of Mount Vernon Square has always perplexed me. Five years ago, I think Corduroy (12th and K) was very fringe in terms of being considered downtown, but now it's probably not wrong to think it is. But does downtown now go east of 12th street? Are there any official maps or borders? Unofficial maps? I've looked for awhile, and nothing seems definitive. (We could have the same discussion about S. Dupont and Downtown as well - where does one end and the other begin?) (I'll probably delete this thread later, so please just make the answers as poorly written and dashed-off as you'd like, and maybe consider them like you would a PM to me) I've never thought of DC having a "downtown" area. I just think of it as DC, and further break it down into quadrants and neighborhoods. But then again, I'm not from this area. I'm from Philly, where downtown just sounds funny-it's Center City. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leleboo Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 When I lived at 12th and Mass it was probably the epicenter of the no-man's-land in terms of naming. Not quite Mount Vernon Square, south of Logan Circle, east of Thomas Circle (is that even a neighborhood?), north of Penn Quarter...By the time you get to 10th and NY, I'd say you could fudge it into MVS, PQ, or DT and be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 13, 2009 Author Share Posted October 13, 2009 I've never thought of DC having a "downtown" area. I just think of it as DC, and further break it down into quadrants and neighborhoods. But then again, I'm not from this area. I'm from Philly, where downtown just sounds funny-it's Center City. with the Dining Guide; I have no choice but to categorize. (yeah, i know, should do by cuisine too ... will come at some point ...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcs Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Not that it is the authority of such matters, but if you search Google Maps for "washington dc downtown"* and zoom in just a bit, it seems to consider "Downtown" to be the area bounded by 14th Street to the West, the Mall to the South, the Capitol to the East, and Mount Vernon Square to the North. That is consistent with the identification provided on the DC tourism website. *For some reason, I am unable to post the link for this search, so you will have to do it yourself, if you are so inclined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 13, 2009 Author Share Posted October 13, 2009 Not that it is the authority of such matters, but if you search Google Maps for "washington dc downtown"* and zoom in just a bit, it seems to consider "Downtown" to be the area bounded by 14th Street to the West, the Mall to the South, the Capitol to the East, and Mount Vernon Square to the North. That is consistent with the identification provided on the DC tourism website. *For some reason, I am unable to post the link for this search, so you will have to do it yourself, if you are so inclined. Yes but I try and be more "neighborhoody". If there's a name for 10th & NY like NoBu or MoMa or Midtown or Luddite then I'd like to find out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hungry prof Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Wikipedia offers this map of DC neighborhoods (click on it to make it somewhat larger), which would put that location in "Downtown." And if wikipedia says it's true. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leleboo Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Luddite Nailed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 13, 2009 Author Share Posted October 13, 2009 Wikipedia offers this map of DC neighborhoods (click on it to make it somewhat larger), which would put that location in "Downtown." And if wikipedia says it's true. . . Yes I saw that earlier (but couldn't blow it up on my computer screen for some reason). That little green rectangle on the "Downtown" map is Mt. Vernon Square, so I have maybe sub-categorized myself into a black hole, i.e., nothing fits 10th and NY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktmoomau Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I would put it in Mount Vernon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squidsdc Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 I would follow the DC Business Improvement Districts for classifying areas for the dining guide. Here's a link showing the BID organizations, and 10th and NY falls within the Mount Vernon Triangle BID. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 13, 2009 Author Share Posted October 13, 2009 I would follow the DC Business Improvement Districts for classifying areas for the dining guide. Here's a link showing the BID organizations, and 10th and NY falls within the Mount Vernon Triangle BID. i don't think it does (click); it appears to fall into downtown (click) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hungry prof Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Perhaps it's time the dining guide take the form of a google map with clickable pins for each restaurant, rather than a simple old list. It would solve the need to give everything a neighborhood. [Dashes away from heavy object being thrown my way. . .] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squidsdc Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 i don't think it does (click); it appears to fall into downtown (click) Interesting...it appears on both maps. And if you look at my link, the BID's have the same postal address. Why don't you query them directly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 13, 2009 Author Share Posted October 13, 2009 Perhaps it's time the dining guide take the form of a google map with clickable pins for each restaurant, rather than a simple old list. It would solve the need to give everything a neighborhood. [Dashes away from heavy object being thrown my way. . .] It would be nice to have the option, but try the low-fi version in your cell phone sometime. I'm not exaggerating when I say I actually USE the dining guide myself nearly every day (not only that, i have it as an icon in my iPhone) now if i could only catch up and bring it up-to-the-minute. each month, i tell myself "once i get it current, i'm going to keep it current every single day," but i eventually fall a few weeks behind, like i did this time, and now i'm paying the price trying to catch up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimRice Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Wikipedia offers this map of DC neighborhoods (click on it to make it somewhat larger), which would put that location in "Downtown." And if wikipedia says it's true. . . This map also calls it Boiling Air Force base Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaRiv18 Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Trying to pigeonhole Againn, I'm wondering if 10th & NY Ave is considered "Downtown." For another perspective the DC Office of Planning has a very strict view of what Downtown is, in terms of defining it as a historic district (it's basically Chinatown and most of Penn Quarter) For how far south Dupont Circle reaches, the map is here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lackadaisi Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 This is my neighborhood, I don't believe there is really a name. Sometimes I say downtown, but I know that isn't quite right. Then again, I am a block north. So, I usually say convention center area, which I think would apply to there as well if you keep in mind the old convention center. Soon enough, I think it may be enveloped by City Center area. But, that isn't really in usage now for anything other than the parking lot. ETA: For purposes of the dining guide, I think "downtown" would be entirely appropriate as it is west of City Center and south of Mass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Landrum Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 The fact that Don doesn't quite know where "downtown" is and thinks his iPhone will help him get there explains oh-so-very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweaked Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 Mount Vernon/Convention Center would seem to be the most accurate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaRiv18 Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 Soon enough, I think it may be enveloped by City Center area. Agree. Interestingly (for lack of a better transitional adverb), Shaw may be as close to 10th and NY as Mt. Vernon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waitman Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 It's Shaw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leleboo Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 It's Shaw. That far South? I saw the Shaw historic signs all the time when I'd walk my dog north of Mass on 10th, but never as far south as NY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 14, 2009 Author Share Posted October 14, 2009 It's Shaw. I would never consider this intersection Shaw - it doesn't "feel" like Shaw to me. Okay, thanks for all the input - usefulness aside, this has actually been a fairly interesting discussion for me because over the years, I've become sort-of a DC-cartography buff <-- lame word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leleboo Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 buff <-- lame word. enthusiast? savant? passioné? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TedE Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 enthusiast? savant? passioné? Nerd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leleboo Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 Nerd Quite!Oh, wait, you didn't mean me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waitman Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 That far South? I saw the Shaw historic signs all the time when I'd walk my dog north of Mass on 10th, but never as far south as NY. I always think of Shaw -- on that stretch, anyway -- as running from NY Ave. north. If it's not Logan, Downtown, or Bloomingdale. must be Shaw. According to the always reliable Wikipedia, ;)the neighborhood actually starts on M Street, just north of NY -- for whatever that's worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lackadaisi Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I don't think that either Shaw or Mount Vernon go south of Mass. Also, there are Shaw signs throughout Shaw, and there are no signs there. It's not even close to Bloomingdale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaRiv18 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 According to the always reliable Wikipedia, ;)the neighborhood actually starts on M Street, just north of NY -- for whatever that's worth. The map I link above says its starts on L and heads north. It actually dips down below Mass Ave to include that triangle park bounded by L, Mass, and 11th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leleboo Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 The map I link above says its starts on L and heads north. It actually dips down below Mass Ave to include that triangle park bounded by L, Mass, and 11th. Can we create a new neighborhood? If this is really an area in debate or something of a no-man's-land, I mean. We seem to have a pretty thorough list of it being called various things by various sources; who (or what entity) is the final arbiter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lola007 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Local geography has never been my strong suit and I've seen my share of nitpicking on the subject (most notably about my own neighborhood-which isn't Shaw, btw), so I'm resisting getting in the mix. If you want to have a good laugh, how about a web site that includes "Annapolis" as a DC neighborhood? I'm not joking. It's that way on Urbanspoon.com. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waitman Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I don't think that either Shaw or Mount Vernon go south of Mass. Also, there are Shaw signs throughout Shaw, and there are no signs there. It's not even close to Bloomingdale. I am no geographer but I'd suggest that Shaw and Bloomingdale are pretty much cheek to jowl from Ledroit Park south for several blocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 15, 2009 Author Share Posted October 15, 2009 I'm going to start calling this area Dontown in the dining guide unless someone comes up with a better answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hungry prof Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I'm going to start calling this area Dontown in the dining guide unless someone comes up with a better answer. How about Rockville? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waitman Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I'm going to start calling this area Dontown in the dining guide unless someone comes up with a better answer. TRANY. TRiangle Above New York. All the hip neighborhoods are doing acronyms and it will remind us old-timers about the nightlife in that section back in the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMango Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I'm going to start calling this area Dontown in the dining guide unless someone comes up with a better answer. "The lights are much brighter there..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giant shrimp Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Trying to pigeonhole Againn, I'm wondering if 10th & NY Ave is considered "Downtown." it sits in an odd pocket of downtown that still seems lonely and used to be sketchy when the greyhound bus station was across the street. when you departed the city late at night, walking to the station from this direction seemed risky, but by the time you purchased your ticket you realized that it didn't matter, because standing within the station was just as bad. we once saw a tall homeless man keel over right in front of us. i don't know what bus he was on but he was rigid as a door and landed flat on his face, and he didn't feel a thing despite his nose. familiarity with downtown started with visits to the raleigh hotel, from which wttg broadcasted. i remember captain tugg. ninth street was a boundary of sorts because it was a red light district, but there was a place on the corner of f street that sold lava lamps and keene big eye paintings, although i'm not sure they were originals. for good food, you had to edge a bit further away from downtown, to chinatown. i remember eating at the golden palace one weekday night before heading off to charlottesville, and it couldn't have been earlier than midnight, so they must have kept late hours. then i headed over to the bus depot, and i didn't really feel i was headed for downtown, though not exactly walking away from it either. if i had been look for men desperately dressed up as women i believe i would have headed up to mass. ave., close to where corduroy is today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonRocks Posted October 15, 2009 Author Share Posted October 15, 2009 ninth street was a boundary of sorts because it was a red light district, Thirty years ago, it was on 14th. Street. BTW, how long are those ridiculous No Right Turn signs going to be up in areas that haven't been red-light-district problems in ten years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waitman Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 The bus depot, and across the street (not making this up) The Terminal Hotel, home (or neighbor to) The Cafe Naples with all the boys in the leather running shorts and bright bandannas....One night I was at the Burger King in the bust station and some guy sat down with me, looked me in the eye and said: "I killed a man, once." Burger King or that old Salvadoran place and Stoneys were the closest options. In the 80s I spent a lot of time walking from an apartment on Mass and 11th to bar jobs on 19th street. The trannies kind of ran from 11th to 9th, as I recall, mostly along Mass Ave and just south. The "regular: red light district was by no means limited to 14th street but that was, as they say, the way to bet, but the girls seemed to move in herds based on whatever corners they'd been driven off of by the cops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leleboo Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 We just moved away from the area this spring, having lived there since we moved to town in '07. Definitely used to see the ladies of the night (when we'd walk the dog super-early in the morning), often in animated conversation with a cop, on the lawn of the church on the corner. One of them tried to tell my neighbor that she should join them because she walked like she already was one. I don't think my neighbor took it as a compliment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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