johnb

Ahhh, Tom Carvel. Tom was the ultimate answer to the question "why should business owners never be allowed to do their own ads?" I always thought he sounded more like he was drunk and had gravel in his mouth!

FWIW, there really was an Ollie once upon a time. Rocks no doubt has the full historical information. IIRC he was a guy with a little "trolly-like" burger place that folks liked, and some guys came along and tried to set up a local chain based on the idea. There were several little "trolleys" for a while (they were just little tiny buildings on the sidewalk, like overgrown kiosks), but most or all have long since disappeared. This was all about 1979. I think the business model was "if it doesn't work in location A we can move it to location B and try again." Anyway, since we're on a history kick, I thought someone might be interested.

Amazing how any mention of chicken, burgers, or pizza stirs up such a frenzy on just about any food board.

mmm mmmm good! Truthfully tho, my fast food chicken preferences lie elsewhere (no, NOT KFC)

Tom mentioned this place in his "weekly dish" this morning, commenting on the dress code it seemed, and what it says about U St. He seemed generally positive about the restaurant, tho the comments were mostly factual. It would appear he was in the process of checking it out for a full-blown review. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...5082300282.html

I'm not sure how rhapsodic it was, but here's my report,circulated by e-mail earlier, on today's lunch <<A small but convivial group of nine chowhounds and one chowpup gathered today for the fifth, and penultimate, meeting in our series. In spite of its small size, we saw two new faces in the group. Like last week, we did four apps and seven mains, but only one order of each, which was plenty. Our four apps included (as always, numbers refer to the numbers in the "book" version of the menu at the restaurant, not the carry-out version which is slightly different) # 7 salty duck, # 13 beef jerky, # 34 hot spicy oil chow foon, and smoke fish which is on the chalkboard menu. The smoke fish were warm, not much to look at (as per Tom's comment in his WP review), but round and mellow with a complex sweetness in the sauce. Very nice. The duck was cold, and there was lots of it, very tender and flavorful with a thin layer of fat. The jerky was small slices of beef, dry, with a cumin infused coating. The chow foon was, oddly, fairly narrow noodles but with a subtle spice sauce, which grew more intense in the mouth--the sleeper among the apps. They were all "re-order worthy." Of the mains, four were from the regular menu: # 63 Gen. Tsao boneless duck (repeated from last week because I never got any), # 74 stir-fried eggplant, # 87 flounder with dried pepper, and # 44 boiled beef and vegetable. Two were from the wallboard: scallops with Chinese squash, and Chen Tsang beef. Last was a special request garlic shrimp. The shrimp was a competent rendition of the dish, which appears on the American menu. The Chen Tsang beef is an old friend, the "Chinese sloppy joe" that we had the second week, a wonderful dish of minced beef redolant of cummin and spice served with buns to "make your own.". The scallops with squash were silky and smooth. The flounder in diced pepper is a favorite of Chinese customers, rich hulks of fish (today it was cod) and tofu covered in various finely chopped sweet and hot peppers, fairly wet, and with a curious tang. The boiled beef was like other hot pot dishes done by chef Chang, a rich brown sauce with slices of soft, fully cooked beef, and nicely spiced. The eggplant was double cooked, with a fine clear coating having just a hint of sweetness. Finally, best of all, the boneless duck, and now I know why the other table polished it off last week. A seminal dish, duck coated and fried, then cut in serving slices and masked with a sauce that seemed to include every possible flavor, hot, sweet, sour, fruity, you name it, which perfectly complemented the fattiness of the duck. A must-order dish. The total came to $13 per person all-in. Next week is the final episode. We'll go all-out to have some great dishes. I know some are away this time of year, but hope many of you will nonetheless be able to join us.>>

That certainly looks like a cheese and crabmeat concoction to me in that link!

Well I'm still workable but barely, so I understand (LOL) Bring a photocopy if its convenient. That would be great.

You're such a poet and I didn't know it! By all means, provide us your article. And here I thought the best lowbrow steak deal was that never-ending special at Binion's! Talk about gambler subsidized! But isn't your strategy a bit dated, in the sense that LV has morphed quite a bit and now the really fine restaurants are profit centers? I know there are still deals around at a "certain" level, but, assuming you want them, that won't get you meals at the level of Picasso, Alex, N9ne, etc. etc. (unless of course you're a whale, which Janet's slot playing is definitely not going to qualify us for). Of course there's always LOS, Rosemary's, In-N-Out, and others who don't fit in to the strange economics out there.

Upstream is open as of yesterday Aug. 19. Seems to be pretty good. Wide selection of fresh fish species, sushi being made on the premises (no bar tho), and competitive prices. It's on Georgia, just south of the beltway (maybe 1/4 mile) behind the Shell station, in the same strip mall with Staples.

I'll be very interested to hear your impressions. I have been to LOS (as everyone calls it for shorthand) and it is great. I can tell you Dave Feldman is its biggest booster on the SW board of CH---he's probably brought more business into LOS than you've brought to Maestro and Lab combined, well, maybe not that much but a lot. Be sure to add Luv-it Custard to your to do list. In addition to LOS, I'm also planning on Rosemary's and of course Alex. Do you plan to go to Il Mulino? Speaking of New Orleans, if we could only get Tony Uglesich to open a place in LV, or better yet DC....... Actually, I spoke to him at length when he was in town and tried to convince him to buy a piece of retirement property near mine in NC, and he seemed interested Wouldn't that be a coup!

Stephen I'm surprised a man of your breeding and culture would be caught dead at Circus Circus, good value or no (I have a hard time seeing CC as a CH-style hole-in-the-wall and therefore an acceptible eatery, but maybe that's my hangup). As for Joe's comments on In-N-Out, I would add that one should order fries well-done! Alex at the Wynn is getting buzz now to the effect it may have usurped Picasso's place as the #1 fine dining spot in town. Of course Zagat wouldn't show that yet in any event. And whether it's rating will rise to the In-N-Out level, we shall see--perhaps that's too much to hope for. I plan to dine there in November and will report. Of course, anybody's comments about it would be appreciated.

It appears Sietsema's review this Sunday is TemptAsian. Here's the link http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?n...file&id=1114594 We have two more Tuesday lunches in our series

Sorry the quote in my post above throws it all a bit off--I was actually responding to the first paragraphs of the linked article. My fault. Anyway, the point was that dozens/hundreds/thousands of other wine makers, is/are making wine that pleases the taste of a particular influential critic and his followers, not wine that necessarily tastes good or is the best that could be made from that batch of grapes. All too often buyers go in and buy a particular wine because "Parker gave it a (fill in the number), and I would never buy a wine that Parker didn't give at least a (fill in a slightly lower number)." This kind of mindlessness has had a profound effect on the wine business at all levels, and I see it as a major, if not THE major, problem in the wine business today. I can't say whether the wines of any particular winery please or don't please anybody (and ot must be clear by now that I have no idea what Parker rates anything--it's the last thing I'd take time to check), but the attitude is out there and it has been fostered by this one, self-appointed I would add, critic. In my opinion that is not good, and it is the connection between what I wrote and what came before in this thread. It's also not something that others haven't said before. But it is just my opinion.

I've been interested in wine since 1968. In those years, the main conclusion I've reached is that, in the wine field, there is more horse manure being flung around than just about any other field you can name. And IMO the chief flinger is RP himself. The basis of his success is simple. Take a field that every self-styled cool person feels he must make everyone around him think he knows about but in his heart he knows he doesn't have a clue, and reduce it all to a simple number, on a scale which is easy to understand, intuitive, but still wide enough to allow for some fineness in the "grades" (remember, the scale used before him was typically 5 or 10 points). However phony it may be, it was a great success and now the whole world of wine must bow to his opinion, because of the market power produced by all the fools who buy in to such nonsense. It's a pity. The other conclusion I've reached is that the correlation between quality of wine and its price is an exceptionally weak one. Just my 2 cents.

I too have been there since GG left and the mini-burgs were just fine. Maybe they're easy to make???? Make some, and invite me over for a test!

For any who may be interested, here is my brief report on today's lunch at TemptAsian, the fourth in our series: Seventeen of us showed up today, in spite of the questionable weather, to further sample Temptasian's menu. It was great to see some new faces, including some from Don Rockwell's group and from the Washington Wine and Cheese group, along with Tyler Cowen who needs no introduction. We tried four apps and seven mains, mostly old favorites and suggestions from Todd Kliman's recent column. Among the apps, highlights for me were the old favorite baby wontons and fish-cilantro rolls, and especially the spicy beef roll which was fragrant sliced beef and shredded veggies wrapped up and fried, a bit reminicent of a Vietnamese banh mi. The chicken in cilantro sauce was no slacker either. The mains included two old favorites: Tong Po pork and roasted fish with green onion. What is left to say? New dishes included three Kliman picks: fish with sour mustard greens (greens were more sweet than sour and excellent), fried sliced beef in dried pot (??) which was beef done similarly to the roasted fish, ie with cumin and green chili and served over a flame (so good), and General Tsao boneless duck, which apparently was very good but I can't say for sure because it never made it to my table so we'll order it again next week thank you very much. We rounded out the menu with Kung pao chicken and shredded pork with ferny vegetable, both nice if not spectacular. Chef Chang once again sent out a nice dessert, this time a sweet corn "soup" with tiny rice (I think) dumplings and a very subtle spice. The cost was $14 per person all in. We couldn't eat it all, so Bruce's life was saved since his wife had said "no leftovers, dog house for you big guy." Before leaving I asked some questions about the untranslated wallboard menu and even about good things on the American Chinese menu, so next week we may be able to branch out just a bit. Hope to see all of you once again. Only two more Tuesdays until Labor Day.

I find "the buzz" and "openings" sections of The List to be useful in helping keep track of what's going on around town. Now if DR would only tell us what the big news is, I'd feel fulfilled!

Panda makes good points. I too spent some years of my life in the big wormy apple, doing grad work at that same august institution of higher learning as he. My take on NY vs. DC restaurants is that the differences are mostly rooted in the physical dis-similarities between the two places. I refer to both population and how folks live. Anyone, even Joe, would probably agree that NY (Manhattan) has a greater number of restaurants at all quality levels than does DC (the District). In part it's pure population difference--Manhattan is three times bigger than DC, and almost certainly has an even greater gap in those who tend to patronize restaurants, ie young, rich, smart, handsome, in other words like me and other Rockwellians, but I digress. More important, however, is the mode of living. Down here, most folks can and do cook at home a lot; restaurant-going tends to be the exception (not true of all I know, but we're talking the big picture here!). Consider on the other hand the typical NY apartment kitchen. Tiny, dark, no waste disposer, no dishwasher, small refrigerator, tiny cooktop, at best erratic oven, trash chute down the hall, long schlepp with groceries from the store, etc. etc. Who wouldn't eat out a lot? And New Yorkers do. This creates a huge restaurant market, and more important an eating out culture, that DC (not to mention the rest of civilized society) just doesn't have. Does all this make the average quality level of NY restaurants better than DC? Does this make New Yorkers more sophisticated, cool, people than us in DC? I think not. Sure there's more of them, but Joe is right; we can hold our own in quality terms very well thank you. Restaurants and cool people. We just don't have the sheer numbers Just my thoughts.

Don't forget, they have a buy 10 get 1 free deal (cash only). Get the little card, which they punch each time you spend at least $20. Bring cash.

Yes, we got there about 8 and were disappointed about the scallops too, since my SO was looking forward to that. The substitute salmon was excellent however. I had the lamb and ravioli which was very good--the lamb was a bit chewy for my old teeth, but the flavor and crustiness were right on. And the soft-shell crab I started with was one of the best ever, as previous posters have noted. They must have run out of Creme Anglais too!!!!, beause my fresh berry dessert came out with sorbet instead of the promised CA. Oh well, it was still a fitting end to the meal and to RW. Corduroy continues as one of the best RW deals anywhere.

I go there for lunch occasionally, and like it very much. I've posted about it on CH occasionally (sorry--no time to look for a link). The food is, I would say, authentic church soul 2005, ie it's loaded with fats and sugars and the deserts are topped with, if anything, cool-whip not cream, 'cause after all that's what most folks eat at home, so like it or not that's authentic. If you're looking for a church basement soul food experience it's the real thing--they make it right there, with love. Note, the lines can be loooong any day, not just Friday, mainly because the servers are not into efficiency (remember how the line used to move at Scholl's?) but they do like to chat with the regulars. I even took my elderly (very white) folks (from Southern Indiana) there once, and they liked it. It's definitely worth a visit but accept it for what it is, which is not gourmet. I recommend the fried fish of the day, the greens, the mac n cheese, the sweet pototoes, cornbread, etc. I've never tried any dessert; that factory topping stuff just ain't me.

Joe's is one of the great restaurants in the DC area, note I said restaurants not just Chinese restaurants. I'd love to join a DR chow group there. Count me in.

Upon request, I am posting here the summaries that circulated after the first two "TemptAsian Tuesdays", the lunches that several of us are having every Tuesday at this place to try as much of the menu as we can. 10 showed up the first week and 17 yesterday, and all are welcome. July 26 All: We had our first Tuesday get-together at TemptAsian today, attended by a total of 10 hard-core chowhound types. We ordered three appetizers, the fish rolls with cilantro, five spice sliced beef (served room temp.), and baby wontons with chili oil (2 orders of each). All were delightful; the first two contained lots of cilantro, which appears to be one of chef Chang's core ingredients. We then moved on to eight main courses, seven from the regular Chinese menu and the eighth ordered by JamesG from the Chinese only page (Jump in water chicken, which turned out to be a tangy poached chicken served room temp.) They were all good; most were classic dishes which were excellent examples of their preparation. The highlights for me were the Tong Po roast pork with pine nuts which many Chinese groups have been spotted eating(you don't want to be on a diet for this one) and roasted fish with green onion ( a China Star special but on the regular menu at TA). We had one of the best dried string beans I've had, also fragrant beef stew in hot pot, Tong Po duck, great Ma Po bean curd, and shredded pork with garlic (again, one of the best of this dish ever). The dishes were spicy but none was overwhelmingly so--we'll have to have the heat turned up for a dish or two next week. The check came to $12 each plus tip. Chef Chang came out for applause from all and Chinese conversation with JamesG, which I think led to his promising to do some "special things" for us next week. If you weren't there, we hope you'll make it to one of these soon. 12:30 every Tuesday through August at least August 2 All: We had our second Temptasian Tuesday yesterday. 17 attended. This time James G helped work out the menu and gave a lot of leeway to the restaurant in the selections. Here's what Chef Zhang ordered for us: Coral Mandarin Fish Chen Cang Beef with Steamed Buns Loquat Shrimp Sweet Pea Duck Strips Mountain Town Chicken Strips Salt-Pepper Eggplant Chinese Broccoli with Oyster Sauce Then we (James mostly) added the following appetizers: Dumplings with Hot-Sour Sauce Pumpkin Cakes Cold Wheat Gluten Scallion Pancakes Spicy Diced Rabbit On the whole, it was another great meal. The biggest hit IMO was the Chen Cang Beef which was sort of a Chinese sloppy joe, and showed once again Chef Chang's mastery of cumin. Also very good was the mountain town chicken--spicy and even "fruity" in flavor. By far the biggest visual hit of all time was the coral fish. Tho in flavor it was similar to normal sweet and sour fish, it was spectacular to look at. You'll see it in the pictures. The loquat shrimp were also unique, sort of a pork? stuffed shrimp with loquat sauce. The dumplings and rabbit were the standouts in the appetizers, but all the apps were good. Overall, this meal was nowhere near as spicy as the first one (perhaps because the restaurant folks just can't believe we really want the hot stuff??), so we will be careful next week to get back to spicy and numbing dishes, and I expect some of these will be hot pots which Chef Chang does so well but were missing yesterday. The total check was $14.50 plus tip, and everybody left full. Here is a link to some photos James took. photos: http://shuanglong.smugmug.com/gallery/704189 Hope to see you all again next week, when the theme will be "some like it hot!"

It is item # 65 on the Chinese menu, just above Lake Windless prawns (squid, or fish). It's a regular menu item at Temptasian, tho it was a special at China Star. The Chinese menu is mostly in both English and Chinese. In general, ask for the Chinese menu and go to work. Your best bet as always is to look at what the Chinese people around you are eating and ask for that. Better yet, join us next Tuesday at lunch and sample several things with a like-minded group.