Amish Chicken

[Kibbee Nayee]

I see the menu item "Amish Chicken" show up all over the DC metropolitan area, and I have personally tried it Jackson 20, Old Angler's Inn, Barrel and Crow, New Heights, and maybe a dozen other places.

I grew up in Lancaster, PA, which can be considered Amish country. I've seen them raise and process chickens, and there is nothing at all special about it. The chicken pens throughout eastern Lancaster County are about as dirty and putrid as anything you would imagine at Purdue or Tyson, and the relatively high-paying jobs of my youth at the chicken farms were considered the dirtiest and most dangerous jobs in Amish country -- and I worked at an iron foundry back then!

So what is this Amish Chicken that I see on all of these menus around here, as if "Amish" as a descriptive adjective confers some mystical blessing on these birds? When properly cooked and presented, they could have come from the poultry section of Giant or Safeway for all we know. I would be interested in others' opinions on the subject.

[Mark Slater]

This might clear it up. 

 

[Kibbee Nayee]

Mark, that was frikkin' hilarious.

[Poivrot Farci]

"Amish" chicken means absolutely nothing. There is no "Amish" breed.  It is novel way to market what is invariably Cornish-Cross broilers which are mutant birds genetically engineered to grow very quickly -faster than their legs can keep up- which makes them shiftless, reluctant to forage if they are on pasture or even seek out water.  It is possible that their birds are raised on pasture, but if they are, there's a missed opportunity to highlight that they get sunlight and access to bugs if they're up for it.   Senat Poultry in NJ raises Penobscott/Cobb cross (a Maine breed with normal breast to leg ratio) and they were offered with the feet (practical for pulling tendons).  They're halal and some of the better birds commercially available to restaurants beyond the small farmers.

The US doesn't have much in the way of labeling integrity beyond Bourbon or Big Gulp and almost anything can be marketed as "grass-fed", "sustainable", "natural" or whatever Madison Ave greenwashing gibberish.  As for chickens labeled without growth hormones, they've been banned since the Eisenhower administration (long before they took lead out of gasoline), but everyone likes to be reminded of how wholesome their ethically bankrupt food is.

[DonRocks]

1 hour ago, Poivrot Farci said:

"Amish" chicken means absolutely nothing. There is no "Amish" breed.  It is novel way to market what is invariably Cornish-Cross broilers which are mutant birds genetically engineered to grow very quickly -faster than their legs can keep up- which makes them shiftless, reluctant to forage if they are on pasture or even seek out water.  It is possible that their birds are raised on pasture, but if they are, there's a missed opportunity to highlight that they get sunlight and access to bugs if they're up for it.   Senat Poultry in NJ raises Penobscott/Cobb cross (a Maine breed with normal breast to leg ratio) and they were offered with the feet (practical for pulling tendons).  They're halal and some of the better birds commercially available to restaurants beyond the small farmers.

The US doesn't have much in the way of labeling integrity beyond Bourbon or Big Gulp and almost anything can be marketed as "grass-fed", "sustainable", "natural" or whatever Madison Ave greenwashing gibberish.  As for chickens labeled without growth hormones, they've been banned since the Eisenhower administration (long before they took lead out of gasoline), but everyone likes to be reminded of how wholesome their ethically bankrupt food is.

Look at this post I wrote 11-years ago:

Dutch Country Farmers' Market

[kieplangdu]

19 hours ago, Poivrot Farci said:

"Amish" chicken means absolutely nothing. There is no "Amish" breed. .....

Amish chicken means chicken raised by the Amish. The Amish being simple living also raise their chicken with less crowded and also with different breed due to them breeding their chicken themselves. 

[Poivrot Farci]

There is no legal definition of what "Amish" means as it relates to poultry production.  It is a broad term that does not distinguish which breed, how, where or by whom the poultry is raised (Mennonites drive cars and use email).  It loosely signifies "Amish" country which extends all the way to Indiana.  Contrast that with the strict regulations that make a Bresse chicken deserving of it's label.  What is being sold in Mechanicsville directly to end-user consumers may not be what is sold wholesale to restaurants which require USDA inspection in excess of a certain amount of chickens processed.  

Rhode Island Red's are primarily raised for egg production and it takes about 12-16 weeks for them to reach market weight (a very long time compared to production breeds), so the Amish would have to charge accordingly and with such a premium it would be reasonable to market a heritage breed, just like they do with heirloom vegetables.  It would be curious for a producer or restaurant not to capitalize on a product that fetches a higher price based on quality given the marketability of "farm-name", "breed-specific" and "animal husbandry method" menu descriptors which satisfy consumer conscience.  

The chickens one can catch in the hen houses are most likely older egg-layers, not broilers. Until broilers reach market weight, they are susceptible to predation (hawks, foxes, raccoons) and are generally raised in covered, mobile enclosures outdoors without roosts.  

[kieplangdu]

5 hours ago, Poivrot Farci said:

There is no legal definition of what "Amish" means as it relates to poultry production.  It is a broad term that does not distinguish which breed, how, where or by whom the poultry is raised (Mennonites drive cars and use email).  It loosely signifies "Amish" country which extends all the way to Indiana.  Contrast that with the strict regulations that make a Bresse chicken deserving of it's label.  What is being sold in Mechanicsville directly to end-user consumers may not be what is sold wholesale to restaurants which require USDA inspection in excess of a certain amount of chickens processed.  

Rhode Island Red's are primarily raised for egg production and it takes about 12-16 weeks for them to reach market weight (a very long time compared to production breeds), so the Amish would have to charge accordingly and with such a premium it would be reasonable to market a heritage breed, just like they do with heirloom vegetables.  It would be curious for a producer or restaurant not to capitalize on a product that fetches a higher price based on quality given the marketability of "farm-name", "breed-specific" and "animal husbandry method" menu descriptors which satisfy consumer conscience.  

The chickens one can catch in the hen houses are most likely older egg-layers, not broilers. Until broilers reach market weight, they are susceptible to predation (hawks, foxes, raccoons) and are generally raised in covered, mobile enclosures outdoors without roosts.  

Right - It means raised by Amish people. You don't go to any other "farmers" who happen to be in Amish country and call their chicken Amish. 

Poultry exemption. Polyface slaughters their own chickens and sells to restaurants, retails.

An Amish chicken in Mechanicsville sells for $10 each. You should expect to pay at least $18 in ethnic grocery store for the same quality. BTW, your "reasoning" is  based on your assumption. You should see it for what it is and forget about your assumption! FYI, you can also buy Amish chicken from Pennsylvania  for $30 each if you are in one of the buying clubs. They deliver here at least once a week.

BTW, I have been buying Amish chicken for over 15 years from Mechanicsville, Pennsylvania and have never ever received a Cornish Cross. 

[ktmoomau]

Ok- I am just going to put this out there...... (and before anyone jumps on me for this, I actually was raised by an Amish nanny on an Amish farm for most all of my non-school time weekday childhood, with her children) I see Amish chicken on menus all around- and I don't for one hot second believe they are all buying their chickens from the Amish.  To me it is a term that refers to a home style type of simple roasted bird. Generally served with a gravy and mashed potatoes.  It is a marketing term with no real meaning.

I am also going to say that being on an Amish dairy farm and living myself on a beef farm, I saw little to no difference in the way they raised their animals than any other small producer on the East Coast/Appalachian area. Now all farmers are different, but let's suffice it to say- they all are not getting certified organic, hormone, antibiotic free.  But I think people *think* that is true.  

[DonRocks]

2 hours ago, kieplangdu said:

The point was Amish chicken means nothing more than chicken raised by the Amish. It doesn't mean organic, free range, etc and from my personal experience, a vast majority of them are not Cornish Cross because they breed their own.  Amish chicken does not mean how it's cooked either. 

This is absolutely correct (although I have no knowledge about Cornish Cross chickens).

Cheers,
Rocks

[Ericandblueboy]

If you google Amish Chicken, it's apparently also a recipe.  

[Kibbee Nayee]

And the most perfect meal involving "Amish" or any other kind of chicken is Lancaster County chicken corn soup, available this time of year, often from a Lancaster County fire hall during a fall festival.

[DonRocks]

8 hours ago, Poivrot Farci said:

"Amish" country which extends all the way to Indiana. 

A couple years ago I got lost in Southern Indiana (not that far from French Lick, believe it or not) - sure enough, there were Amish horse-and-buggys on the side of the road, just like I was in Lancaster County. I had no idea there were settlements in Indiana until then.

[Poivrot Farci]

20 hours ago, kieplangdu said:

BTW, I have been buying Amish chicken for over 15 years from Mechanicsville, Pennsylvania and have never ever received a Cornish Cross. ...

... with different breed due to them breeding their chicken themselves....

What breed are they selling you then?  How long are they raised?  

Cornish cross broilers can be bred and hatched just like any other chicken. They are all domestic chickens (Gallus gallus domesticus).  

I am not contesting that there are Amish who raise chickens and sell them directly to consumers in parts of Appalachia where Amish populations are common. Rather, it is the suggestion that wholesale (restaurant, retail store) “Amish Country poultry” has characteristics beyond who is raising them. As best I can tell, there is nothing in the “Amish country” name that mandates that those raising the chickens are bonafide Christian traditionalists riding buggies and closing their britches with button closures. Or that the broilers are a certain breed, raised for a certain amount of time, fed a particular diet, allotted a certain amount of pasture or slaughtered in a particular manner. There is nothing in Gerber’s Amish Farm that praises Anabaptism and the website seems to be an endorsement of technology. If “Amish Country” chickens have no specific characteristics, it means nothing; a Rabbi, Pentecostal snake charmer and Shaolin monk could just as well raise chickens outside Lancaster and call them “Amish Country” if the farmer’s religion has no meaningful or measurable effect on the bird.

What I did in my previous life in kitchens does not make me an authority on chickens. My reasoning, assumptions and conjecture comes from more recent practical experience. I live next to and work on a 28 acre farm which, in addition to pigs, sheep, and egg layers, raises 1500 “freedom ranger” broilers on pasture annually (fed certified organic feed) which we slaughter ourselves. I am not an accredited expert, but am familiar with the breeds, physiology, life cycle, regulations, labeling requirements and spend plenty of time behind the curtain. Raising poultry for a longer period requires more feed, more labor, more pasture, more fuel, more water, infrastructure and bad weather can lift up a hut and kill 30 of them.  Rhode Island Red's require at least twice as many weeks as a Cornish Cross production variety.

As for Polyface, if they slaughter fewer than 20,000 chickens annually and do not sell across state lines, they are still required to adhere to federal sanitation laws. If they sell across state lines, the regulations change. Polyface makes no claims as to what breed of broilers (meat birds) they raise (a heritage breed is worth advertising) and based on the white feathers of the chicken pictured, I would wager it is a production breed Cornish Cross.  Convince me otherwise. It is not a breed that I favor and does not make Mr. Salatin a monster,  those his huts look more like shanties from a Brazilian Favel (ours are tall enough to stand in, but whatever). Many producers who slaughter more than 1,000 birds on site apply for a 5A license and are inspected a few times a year to ensure that all is clean and up to snuff. The regulations change when a farmer sells to a restaurant/store rather than directly to a consumer  That is probably more work than most Amish are willing to commit to and co-ops relieve much of the burden (slaughtering, distribution).

A $10 chicken with a retail weight of 4lbs is not excessive for a small farm which does not have the economies of scale. The difference between a $10 and $30 chicken likely have to do with the breed, growth rate, geography (feed has to be shipped if they do not grow their own), infrastructure (building broiler huts) labor, slaughtering, fuel, etc…Without a breed, feed, growth period or growing conditions, a $10 chicken means nothing, just as a $10,000 car can’t be rated against a $30,000 car unless one knows the make, model, year, mileage and so on.

Chickens don't have to be contentious.  It is best when the consumer know what they are paying for (growth hormones in poultry were banned during the Eisenhower administration, but we still like to be reminded.  Like unleaded gas.)

[deangold]

We purchased Amish chicken from Huntsman. They were a superb bird.  We dry brined them, spatchcocked and roasted them. A case of 15 ueually was between $230 and $240 so about $15.67 a bird, which cleaned to about 3# after removing the heads, feet and giblets.  

This is from the Huntsman website:

Raised in small community farms in Lancaster, PA, our bird is of barred silver and American partridge rock hen cross. It is a slow growing breed, fed only soybean and corn. The birds roam freely for 13-14 weeks -more than twice as long as typical supermarket chickens.The result is a leaner but more flavorful bird, such characteristics being essential for developing a meaty bird. Chickens are delivered with the head and feet on within 24 hours of slaughtering so you can confidently use a fresh chicken.

• N.Y. dressed, head and feet on

• Eviscerated with giblets

• 15 per case

• 3.5 lb average size

 

[pras]

I assume the conversation stays the same when you refer to "Hutterite Chickens" or is that something different?

[Poivrot Farci]

"From Gravy to Jus, Now 'Amish' Is Trendy" NY Times 1999.

https://www.nytimes.com/1999/03/17/dining/from-gravy-to-jus-now-amish-is-trendy.html

Quote

So what exactly does ''Amish'' mean, in a culinary context?

''It's a marketing ploy,'' said Ariane Daguin, co-owner of D'Artagnan, a Newark-based supplier of Amish chicken to New York restaurants and markets. ''It doesn't mean anything.''

The mystique of the Amish label, Ms. Daguin said, comes from its ''aura of naturalness,'' though chickens raised on Amish farms do not always eat vegetarian feed. Nor are they free-range or free roaming.

There is no doubt that some farmers in Amish areas are raising quality birds then and now.  But that does not mean all birds raised in "Amish Country" are invariably of high quality.  There really should be more attention given to the breed of chickens people raise, sell, buy and serve.  Other meats, fish, fruits and vegetables seem to enjoy distinctions on their labels.  Or are we content with just "Amish apples"?

[DonRocks]

You know, I really think my Amish Market comment is underrated.

[Kibbee Nayee]

I'm glad I started this topic, but I still don't know what I'm getting when I order "Amish Chicken" off a local menu, and I guess that was my point all along.....

[Mark Slater]

9 minutes ago, Kibbee Nayee said:

I'm glad I started this topic, but I still don't know what I'm getting when I order "Amish Chicken" off a local menu, and I guess that was my point all along.....

I'm starting to think that Amish is just another weasel word like "natural" or "organic", other than signifying a chicken raised in Pennsylvania.  

[deangold]

13 hours ago, deangold said:

We purchased Amish chicken from Huntsman. They were a superb bird.  We dry brined them, spatchcocked and roasted them. A case of 15 ueually was between $230 and $240 so about $15.67 a bird, which cleaned to about 3# after removing the heads, feet and giblets.  

This is from the Huntsman website:

Raised in small community farms in Lancaster, PA, our bird is of barred silver and American partridge rock hen cross. It is a slow growing breed, fed only soybean and corn. The birds roam freely for 13-14 weeks -more than twice as long as typical supermarket chickens.The result is a leaner but more flavorful bird, such characteristics being essential for developing a meaty bird. Chickens are delivered with the head and feet on within 24 hours of slaughtering so you can confidently use a fresh chicken.

• N.Y. dressed, head and feet on

• Eviscerated with giblets

• 15 per case

• 3.5 lb average size

 

By the way, I am in total agreement with Poivrot Farci's comment re labeling law. Most US labeling law is really designed to let you know what lies you can put on a label as a producer, no to protect or inform consumers. 

Organic standards are total bull written to allow Whole Foods to sell industrial crap as organic while just outlawing the most egregious industrial practices. Now that Costco and Walmart dominate the natural foods market, the already weak standards are being altered to allow for even more industrial practices.  

All Natural means minimally processed and other than that, nothing. Organic Wild Caught Fish can feed on pollutants and chemicals that would never be allowed in organic farming {at least so far!} Cage Free birds can still be raised in fetid, overcrowded conditions with their beaks cut to minimize the damage they can do to one another {pecking order is the hierarchical ranking among chickens, who can peck who. Low on the pecking order in a crowded situation means birds get pecked to death. High n the pecking order birds can actually peck themselves to death via exhaustion.}

The key is the integrity of the supplier and that is it.  The Amish birds I bought fit a lot of the image that Amish farming in supposed to induce: actually allowed to go outside, only eating whole foods {even if partially supplied by the farmer} and raised by non commercial breeds.  

I'd rather buy produce from someone like Spring Valley or Garner who are ethical farmers but not organic than buy organic crap at Whole Foods like Cal Organics or Earthbound Farms.  

Know your farmer, know your foods remains the best advice, and it results in more costly, but healthier foods.  

 

[pras]

1 hour ago, deangold said:

By the way, I am in total agreement with Poivrot Farci's comment re labeling law. Most US labeling law is really designed to let you know what lies you can put on a label as a producer, no to protect or inform consumers. 

Organic standards are total bull written to allow Whole Foods to sell industrial crap as organic while just outlawing the most egregious industrial practices. Now that Costco and Walmart dominate the natural foods market, the already weak standards are being altered to allow for even more industrial practices.  

All Natural means minimally processed and other than that, nothing. Organic Wild Caught Fish can feed on pollutants and chemicals that would never be allowed in organic farming {at least so far!} Cage Free birds can still be raised in fetid, overcrowded conditions with their beaks cut to minimize the damage they can do to one another {pecking order is the hierarchical ranking among chickens, who can peck who. Low on the pecking order in a crowded situation means birds get pecked to death. High n the pecking order birds can actually peck themselves to death via exhaustion.}

The key is the integrity of the supplier and that is it.  The Amish birds I bought fit a lot of the image that Amish farming in supposed to induce: actually allowed to go outside, only eating whole foods {even if partially supplied by the farmer} and raised by non commercial breeds.  

I'd rather buy produce from someone like Spring Valley or Garner who are ethical farmers but not organic than buy organic crap at Whole Foods like Cal Organics or Earthbound Farms.  

Know your farmer, know your foods remains the best advice, and it results in more costly, but healthier foods.  

 

This debate is similar to debates about Kashrut.  A "K" on a package doesn't mean a thing, but a copyrighted symbol does have meaning ("OU" or "Star K", etc.) as you can determine what standards the OU has before they will let someone use their symbol.

You see different organic certifications on foods, I guess you need to determine their standards and decide if that is something you can get behind or just accept the USDA standards.

[Mark Slater]

10 hours ago, Kibbee Nayee said:

I'm glad I started this topic, but I still don't know what I'm getting when I order "Amish Chicken" off a local menu, and I guess that was my point all along.....

 I'm glad you started it too. It reminded me of the old Internet. Remember that?

[Poivrot Farci]

23 hours ago, deangold said:

We purchased Amish chicken from Huntsman. They were a superb bird.  We dry brined them, spatchcocked and roasted them. A case of 15 ueually was between $230 and $240 so about $15.67 a bird, which cleaned to about 3# after removing the heads, feet and giblets.  

This is from the Huntsman website:

Raised in small community farms in Lancaster, PA, our bird is of barred silver and American partridge rock hen cross. It is a slow growing breed, fed only soybean and corn. The birds roam freely for 13-14 weeks -more than twice as long as typical supermarket chickens.The result is a leaner but more flavorful bird, such characteristics being essential for developing a meaty bird. Chickens are delivered with the head and feet on within 24 hours of slaughtering so you can confidently use a fresh chicken.

• N.Y. dressed, head and feet on

• Eviscerated with giblets

• 15 per case

• 3.5 lb average size

 

These weren't Bobo chickens with a yellow clip on the wing, correct? 

There aren't many slaughterhouses that have the Buddhist exemption which allows them to leave the head & feet on.  Bobo also has a Barred Silver rock as well as a White Plymouth Rock cross (Partridge rock are more often called Partridge Plymouth Rock) which they say are raised upstate NY .  Forgive me fore being suspicious, but dearth of food labeling integrity makes me so.

[deangold]

1 hour ago, Poivrot Farci said:

These weren't Bobo chickens with a yellow clip on the wing, correct? 

There aren't many slaughterhouses that have the Buddhist exemption which allows them to leave the head & feet on.  Bobo also has a Barred Silver rock as well as a White Plymouth Rock cross (Partridge rock are more often called Partridge Plymouth Rock) which they say are raised upstate NY .  Forgive me fore being suspicious, but dearth of food labeling integrity makes me so.

They were the BoBo processed chickens, Damn tags! Huntsman says these chicken are not New York. 

[Poivrot Farci]

10 hours ago, deangold said:

They were the BoBo processed chickens, Damn tags! Huntsman says these chicken are not New York. 

Some might characterize that as consumer fraud. You know, misrepresenting a product, presumably to appeal to consumer sensibilities for which they pay a premium. While it doesn’t rise to the juicy scandal of Bill Koch being sold $400K of phony Jefferson wine (and spending $35 million to brutally investigate his swindling), if I had his coffers and an eccentric obsession with poultry, I’d pony up for genetic chicken testing across the country to determine who is bullshitting whom, dunk them in judicious tar and apply a biblical layering of feathers.

And those Amish aren’t as pure as one would imagine. Apparently they have trouble complying with the English’s environmental regulations.

[DaveO]

This thread has been interesting.  My take is that "Amish" for chicken has no precise meaning.  There are no parameters no definitions, no legal descriptions.  Its a marketing term.   I could get a crummy chicken from a brutish place for the lowest price available and market it as an Amish Chicken.  There are no penalties for doing so.  Buyer beware.

[Ericandblueboy]

If you're buying raw chicken - then Amish chicken means chicken raised by Amish people.  If you're buying a cooked chicken at a restaurant, then Amish chicken is probably the name of the dish and not who raised the bird.   

[DonRocks]

12 hours ago, Poivrot Farci said:

While it doesn’t rise to the juicy scandal of Bill Koch being sold $400K of phony Jefferson wine (and spending $35 million to brutally investigate his swindling), if I had his coffers and an eccentric obsession with poultry, I’d pony up for genetic chicken testing across the country to determine who is bullshitting whom, dunk them in judicious tar and apply a biblical layering of feathers.

Bill Koch got duped twice - once by "Hardy Rodenstock" (who duped the "experts," Jancis Robinson, Robert Parker, Michael Broadbent, etc.) and again by Rudy Kurniawan (who duped Allen Meadows and John Kapon). You're referring to the Rodenstock incident (really now ... "Hardy Rodenstock?")

[deangold]

On 10/23/2019 at 9:01 AM, Poivrot Farci said:

Some might characterize that as consumer fraud. You know, misrepresenting a product, presumably to appeal to consumer sensibilities for which they pay a premium. While it doesn’t rise to the juicy scandal of Bill Koch being sold $400K of phony Jefferson wine (and spending $35 million to brutally investigate his swindling), if I had his coffers and an eccentric obsession with poultry, I’d pony up for genetic chicken testing across the country to determine who is bullshitting whom, dunk them in judicious tar and apply a biblical layering of feathers.

And those Amish aren’t as pure as one would imagine. Apparently they have trouble complying with the English’s environmental regulations.

All I can go by is what I found out from Huntsman. When I started using he chicken, I saw the metal tags with their NY designation. In asking, I was told the chickens were gathered in PA and other Amish areas and taken to BoBo for processing.  I have no way of evaluating that statement.

While I didn't go any further in verifying, what I referred to as Amish chicken was on my menu for the quality of the bird and flavor. The Amish part was used as a descriptor as that is what I thought I was getting. And asking my purveyor seemed to support my use of the word.  

[Mark Slater]

1 hour ago, deangold said:

All I can go by is what I found out from Huntsman. When I started using he chicken, I saw the metal tags with their NY designation. In asking, I was told the chickens were gathered in PA and other Amish areas and taken to BoBo for processing.  I have no way of evaluating that statement.

While I didn't go any further in verifying, what I referred to as Amish chicken was on my menu for the quality of the bird and flavor. The Amish part was used as a descriptor as that is what I thought I was getting. And asking my purveyor seemed to support my use of the word.  

Its like every mussel these days is a PEI.

[Poivrot Farci]

10 hours ago, deangold said:

The Amish part was used as a descriptor as that is what I thought I was getting. And asking my purveyor seemed to support my use of the word.  

Maybe you were getting birds raised in Lancaster by Amish (I can't guarantee otherwise).  It is a long drive to Brooklyn for slaughter and then back to DC/VA to sell.  An unlikely scenario since there are slaughterhouses in PA, but not impossible.  You could always contact Bobo directly and satisfy (y)our curiosity.

[DonRocks]

[If anyone wants to split this thread into "Restaurants and Dining" and "Shopping and Cooking," I will pay them five dollars.]

[Kibbee Nayee]

[By the way, and slightly off-topic, but for those interested, "Lancaster" is pronounced "LANG-kus-ster" by locals.]

[curiouskitkatt]

Amish Chicken on menu at Amenity & Commerce

I also noticed a $21 burger served with  "Lancaster Amish Noble cave aged cheddar" listed on the menu as well. Interesting.

[Poivrot Farci]

11 hours ago, curiouskitkatt said:

Amish Chicken on menu at Amenity & Commerce

I also noticed a $21 burger served with  "Lancaster Amish Noble cave aged cheddar" listed on the menu as well. Interesting.

 I'm inclined to believe that they are not using real tamarins for "Tamarin glazed Angus short ribs" so they may take some liberties with ingredient authenticity.

That menu (and many others) lets up dip our toes into the deep end of the "diver scallop" pool.  I'll wager a bonafide Amish chicken that virtually of the scallops listed as "diver" were brought to the surface with a diesel powered dredge since less than 1% of commercial US scallops are actually caught by hand by underwater divers.

[DonRocks]

15 minutes ago, Poivrot Farci said:

That menu (and many others) lets up dip our toes into the deep end of the "diver scallop" pool.  I'll wager a bonafide Amish chicken that virtually of the scallops listed as "diver" were brought to the surface with a diesel powered dredge since less than 1% of commercial US scallops are actually caught by hand by underwater divers.

I'm not sure "how much less" than 1% the figure is, but I'd be surprised if the amount was 1%, given just how many scallops are sold and consumed in the US.

[Smita Nordwall]

12 hours ago, Poivrot Farci said:

 I'm inclined to believe that they are not using real tamarins for "Tamarin glazed Angus short ribs" so they may take some liberties with ingredient authenticity.

Don Rockwell, pass it along, I am willing to offer my services as a copy editors to any chef who would rather not advertise the use of tiny monkeys or other oddities in their cooking.