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Gentleman Ordering For the Lady


JPW
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So there I was last night ensconced in my seat when a couple walked in and grabbed a table. Just from vibes he gave off I had labeled the guy as a prick. Sure enough, as the waitor was taking their order, I heard "She's going to have... and I'll have..." and it made me cringe.

What do yinz think?

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Just from vibes he gave off I had labeled the guy as a prick.
I think this part of your description says it all. I think depending on the person who is doing it, it could be kinda genteel. As long as that person didn't order without asking me what I wanted.

I have a friend whose girlfriend orders his food for him (emasculation! and why I dislike her). So I've had this discussion with my friends before. I'd say some of us are easier to peg and maybe it's not so bad. Phrases came up like "as long as it's DELICIOUS" or "C'mon we all know that if you order the fattiest, saltiest thing on the menu I'll be happy."

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I'm willing to play along if Scott orders for me, but it frosts my grapes if the waiter asks him what the lady will be having. That probably doesn't make a lot of sense, but that's the way it is.

Joe, the guy you saw probably tells her what her opinions are too ("no, honey, you don't believe that"). :angry: That type is generally easy to pick out.

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So there I was last night ensconced in my seat when a couple walked in and grabbed a table. Just from vibes he gave off I had labeled the guy as a prick. Sure enough, as the waitor was taking their order, I heard "She's going to have... and I'll have..." and it made me cringe.

What do yinz think?

I think that "she" is the cat's mother. Now if the prick in question had said "The lady will have...", while glancing at her deferentially, that would have been lovely, especially if the lady's menu had no prices listed.
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I have actually asked Tripewriter to order for me on occasion. I'm not even entirely sure why, though it's usually when it takes too much effort remembering what I'd chosen while having a conversation, and sometimes it's when I've had a really bad week and just want to sit and wind down a bit before being forced to interact with other people...it would only bug me if Tripewriter, for instance, didn't even let me see the menu. Of course, he has a pretty good sense of what I like -- and don't like -- but that's because he does all the cooking at home :angry: In other words, I don't mind, obviously, when I ask him. I certainly don't mind when I've stepped away from the table, and I'd trust him to make a good decision if he had to in my absence B)

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In situations where the ordering is very straightforward and can be summed up easily, I might order for my wife just to make life easier on the waiter-- "she'll have the pork chop and a house salad to start..."

However, my wife is often the worst nightmare of waiters with her inquiries into special orders and substitutions. She'll order a steak in between medium-rare and medium and have various other special requests. I haven't seen her order a chicken salad sandwich, hold the chicken yet, but I expect to hear it someday.

Therefore, I usually just let her negotiate her way through all the options as I busy myself with :angry:

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I will normally order if we intend on sharing a couple dishes and we've talked about it. Or sometimes, I'll order her a glass of wine if she can't decide which one she wants. But, as a rule I don't normally order for my better half or for anyone else. It just seems weird to be talking about someone in the 3rd person when they are sitting right there. We were out recently and the waiter didn't even look at her, expecting me to order everything. That's kind of rude in my mind, but others may disagree. The other funny thing that I've noticed is that often when we order a light dish and a heavy dish, i.e. salad and a burger, they will mix it up and assume she ordered the lighter dish.

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I think that "she" is the cat's mother. Now if the prick in question had said "The lady will have...", while glancing at her deferentially, that would have been lovely, especially if the lady's menu had no prices listed.
:angry: Too true.
My wife is charmed when I order for her, particularly in a more formal establishment. Do not rush to judgement.
Yeah, but this was not even in the restaurant itself, but the bar area and while formal it wasn't in a starchy environment. However, I see what you mean.

I guess my reaction is couched in two anecdotal sets of experience. One, most of the guys I know who make a habit of ordering for the women in their lives are psychotic control freaks. Two, in my experience waiting tables at neighborhood haunts it was a sign of danger when a guy ordered for his companion. More often than not, that table was going to be a huge PITA and leave a lousy tip.

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Sometimes Jlock orders for me, but this is usually after a long drawn out discussion of what we might want where I beg him to just make the hard decisions.

If I am in my brother's neck of the woods - wherever that may be at the time - he will frequently drag us to holes in the wall and order for us and not even let us see the menu. He does it in a machistic manner, so I could imagine those around would think it odd. And, he often orders things that he thinks I won't like - duck feet, menudo, etc. But, that's why he wouldn't let me see the menu in the first place. Eating like this on a regular basis would be quite annoying, but it can be a fun game, and it forces me to try things I otherwise wouldn't (if only a bite). And, he finds it highly entertaining . . .

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(Sound of Miss Manners smacking her forehead). Proper etiquette once called for the man to discuss his lady's orders with the waiter on her behalf. Some people still observe this. Of course, with the entrance of vast numbers of women into the workforce, and the number of women hosting a business meals involving men, this went by the boards. The guy JPW may well have been a prick, but not because he ordered for his companion--unless, of course, he ordered something she didn't want. THEN he would surely deserve to have a bowl of hot soup dumped in his lap. :angry:

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As some have alluded, this is a matter of context. The things that made this, ahem, gentleman an ass were his intonation, posture, interactions with others, etc. And therefore what is a charming gesture in the appropriate hands is an affected and most likely controlling maneuver conducted under flimsy gauze of chivalry.

That having been said, I will occasionally, and after consultation, order for a date when the situation warrants.

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I like when my husband orders for us. Note that he doesn't choose for me, rather he gives both of our orders to the server. Besides, he has to know what I want to eat before he decides what he wants, since both of us ordering the same entree doesn't happen in his dining world. :angry:

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Paul would seem to be divided on this matter.

In general, the supreme virtue of women is humility. Man represents authority and woman--who after all is made for man--must think of her husband as her head and act in submission.

However, Paul wrote long before the institution of restaurants, so he only instructs women (not only wives) to be silent in one particular type of establishment where men are granted the right to speak.

He does say that a wife does not rule over her own body, but her husband does. This implies he should also order her food. However, the wife rules over his body in turn. She therefore has the right to determine whether or not he should order the braised pork belly or the salad of micro greens.

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There's a significant difference between a man reporting to the waiter what the woman has indicated she wants to eat, and the man deciding what she will eat.

When I worked at BlackSalt, in the fish market, a group of four couples came in for lunch. We heard that they were from an embassy of a middle-eastern country--I can't remember which one. The men wore business suits, and the women all wore head scarves. The were seated in the dining room, and then the men came out to the fish market with the waiter, leaving the women at the table. They looked at the fish in the cases, asked a bunch of questions and then each man told the waiter what he wanted and what to bring for his wife. It kind of gave me the creeps, but on their way out they all seemed happy, and they told us that the food was very good.

When Jonathan and I go out, he often looks at a complicated menu with lots of choices and asks me what I think he will enjoy the most. Based on our long history of eating together, I can usually help him narrow down the options. I don't make the decision about what he will eat, but if it is something that I had my eye on, I will usually go with something else, just because I like to eat many more things than he does. Sometimes, if both dishes are equally appealing to both of us, we will swap plates after eating half. But we each order our own, and it's been a long time since either of us told a waiter what our daughter will have.

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When my wife and I go out, I solicit her menu choices, consult with her on the choice of wines, attend to her particular preferences for "on-the-side", etc., do my best to ensure her perfect, unencumbered pleasure, throw furtive glances between her and the waiter when it's time to order, and otherwise mumble in that uniquely masculine combination of vacillation and braggadocio...

Fuck it. It all depends on context.

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I grew up in the deep south where, in finer establishments, my father always relayed my mother's order to their server. Well, at least until I gave her a copy of this

I can only imagine how we gays and lesbians would respond to a same-sex version of this.

Back when I was a waiter in a Dupont Circle restaurant that -- like some of its customers -- had no distinct sexual orientation, the one type of couple where you could reliably expect one party to order for the other was lesbian couples. As a matter fact, the place was informal enought that they were the only couples to order in that fashion. Can't say why, but is was a clear trend (about, ahem, years ago).

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Back when I was a waiter in a Dupont Circle restaurant that -- like some of its customers -- had no distinct sexual orientation, the one type of couple where you could reliably expect one party to order for the other was lesbian couples. As a matter fact, the place was informal enought that they were the only couples to order in that fashion. Can't say why, but is was a clear trend (about, ahem, years ago).
I think the only time my husband orders for me is if I've gone to the ladies room (and I've told him what I want). I'm probably more likely to order for him, or to decide in the sense that zora was talking about.
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My in-laws came to visit a couple of years ago. They had trouble coping with unfamiliar menu items and my mother-in-law in particular struggled with the myriad choices needed for every aspect of the meal (e.g., what kind of bread). It got to the point where I'd act as an intermediary so as to save the sanity of the waiter/waitress and be sure that my in-laws ordered and received food that they would like and that was what they actually wanted. Otherwise, the exchange would be so confusing for everyone that no one had any clue what they wanted or what was ordered. They'd say something vague like, "well what about this such-and-such?" without asking specifically what they wanted to know. The waiter would take that to mean that they were ordering that item, rather than asking about it. And my husband has a habit of talking aloud about his selections and other menu items as he orders, so the waiter gets confused. I often find that I have to run through the order again with the poor waiter to be sure there are no misunderstandings. Also, my husband has a bit of an accent and it seems to cause some problems when ordering.

Ellen

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I think the only time my husband orders for me is if I've gone to the ladies room (and I've told him what I want).

I do this all the time.

<urgently gestures for the server to come over>

"Hi, I'll have the foie gras with crispy duck-feather, and she'll have the terrine of rabbit heart."

<returns from the ladies room>

"Sorry honey - they were out of the house salad."

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And, in addition to what others and I have said, it's nice when she let's me pretend to be in charge of something. And even nicer when she slides me her credit card and pretend to pay. :angry:

What if she slides you this note just before going home?

지난번에 왔을때 해물파전에 해물이 거의 없었어요. 해물 좀 많이 넣어주세요.

(Cut and paste the above line into Google.)

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For some reason, this discussion reminds me of those high-end restaurants in Las Vegas that hand different menus to the man and woman, the latter without prices.

I would welcome restaurants doing this-- my wife won't see what we're spending on my order (until the Visa bill comes anyway).

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What if she slides you this note just before going home?

???? ??? ????? ??? ?? ????. ?? ? ?? ?????.

I love my Macintosh, but sometimes it frightens me:

When coming to the last time, almost there was not a marine products to the marine products green onion pancake. The marine products petty to put in plentifully.

Clearly, if one is regularly coming to in a Korean restaurant, it's time to lay off the soju :angry:

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Unless you are looking for a slap in the face, or the opportunity to use an EpiPen, never ever order for me.

I'm with you. Unless we're at a pub and late for a show or a game, and I've told my companion what I want just before I'm off to the toilet, I cannot imagine a situation in which I wouldn't be anything other than [annoyed] about someone putting in an order for me.

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