Ray's the Steaks and Retro Ray's (Next Door) - Michael Landrum's Steakhouses in Courthouse - Closed

[Michael Landrum]

Maybe someday Mr Landrum will have a similar charity program at his place in Silver Spring.

The Red Cross at Walter Reed has open-ended, unlimited access to $80 gift certificates for recovering soldiers and their visiting families and loved ones to enjoy dinner at Ray's The Classics. The Red Cross provides transportation via taxi vouchers. Families may use more than one certificate at a time, as many as are necessary, in fact. The idea is for dinner to be enjoyed in the most independent, normalized and private fashion possible.

The original idea was to send them 15 a week to be distributed as they see fit, but now they just come and get them whenever they need more.

Lack of cocktail service does not seem to be an issue so far.

[goodeats]

Very stupid question, as I've not visited in over a year (I know, silly me), but can you only make reservations now in-person? Or are they still accepted by calling?

Reading this thread has lit a fire under my you-know-what to get over there...

Thanks!

[mame11]

The Red Cross at Walter Reed has open-ended, unlimited access to $80 gift certificates for recovering soldiers and their visiting families and loved ones to enjoy dinner at Ray's The Classics. The Red Cross provides transportation via taxi vouchers. Families may use more than one certificate at a time, as many as are necessary, in fact. The idea is for dinner to be enjoyed in the most independent, normalized and private fashion possible.

The original idea was to send them 15 a week to be distributed as they see fit, but now they just come and get them whenever they need more.

Lack of cocktail service does not seem to be an issue so far.

You, sir are a fine gentleman, in fact you are a true Mensch.

[zoramargolis]

You, sir are a fine gentleman, in fact you are a true Mensch.

I think that everyone who harbors animus for Michael Landrum ought to take themselves for a lengthy dip in the Potomac River. Right now.

[DanielK]

...can you only make reservations now in-person? Or are they still accepted by calling?

For RTC (Silver Spring), you may call in advance to make reservations, but for RTS (Arlington) you must show up day-of in-person to make reservations.

[goodeats]

For RTC (Silver Spring), you may call in advance to make reservations, but for RTS (Arlington) you must show up day-of in-person to make reservations.

Thanks!

[danfishe]

The Red Cross at Walter Reed has open-ended, unlimited access to $80 gift certificates for recovering soldiers and their visiting families and loved ones to enjoy dinner at Ray's The Classics. The Red Cross provides transportation via taxi vouchers. Families may use more than one certificate at a time, as many as are necessary, in fact. The idea is for dinner to be enjoyed in the most independent, normalized and private fashion possible.

The original idea was to send them 15 a week to be distributed as they see fit, but now they just come and get them whenever they need more.

Lack of cocktail service does not seem to be an issue so far.

As someone who has occasionally criticized you, let me take my hat off and say that is truly a wonderful thing to do, and shows a high character.

[u-bet!]

So... given the weather and driving conditions, I'm guessing that, if one can manage to make it to Ray's tonight, the chances of being seated sooner rather than later would be better than on the average night?

[bookluvingbabe]

I wouldn't count on it-- this is the type of night where folks will decide to stop in rather than drive all the way home and others will stop in assuming no one else will be there.

But I would go anyway-- I was just think what a perfect night it would be for the crab bisque.

Sigh...

Jennifer, missing pre-parenting days in the city...

[mikeskaj]

As a member of the armed forces soon to be on my way to Iraq I personally thank you for your generosity. I work with the critically wounded soldiers, marines, sailors, and airmen coming through Andrews AFB on their way to Walter Reed and Bethesda. I don't want this to be political, but people need to know that there are still large numbers of wounded men and women coming back from Iraq and Afghanistan all the time and this doesn't look like it will change anytime soon. This offer is incredibly generous on Michael's part as there is the potential for the disbursement of quite a few vouchers.

Personally, I hope to never qualify for one of the vouchers but will continue to take advantage of the fabulous food and fantastic prices at RTS and RTC. Thank you again Michael.

[DanielK]

... Action news reporting ... I can't tell you all of the details, but I can say that a riot broke out on the 1700 block of Wilson Blvd in Arlington this evening. Details are still coming in, but we keep hearing "...out of hanger steak..." being repeated by confused patrons. We'll have film at 11...

[my kids were more than placated by the sliced strip]

[Michael Landrum]

No one is arguing that, but I don't see how Breadline being a better deal than Morton's or BLT doesn't still make it too expenisve. Don't get me wrong, I really don't have a huge problem paying $10 for a sandwich if I'm receiving a) a giant portion (the one I got today was not) or b ) truly superior ingredients (the ones I had today, while good, were not particularly notable).

It's funny that you would point this out because if I go to Breadline and get a ham and cheese ($8.20), a small bowl of soup ($4.75), and a drink ($2.00), I wind up paying a few dollars less than I would if I went to RTS and got a hangar steak, mashed potatoes, and creamed spinach. Am I that ignorant when it comes to food costs or are his pretty damn inflated (or are yours that deflated)?

I run a 55-60% food cost on my steaks, which is why you don't see Ray's The Steaks imitators opening up around the country (it is also quite useful in keeping pesky investors away).

If I were to follow industry standards, based on the cost of my beef (which is the same as at Ruth's Chris, for example), my $29 NY would cost $38-$42, and my $33 Cowboy would cost $45. As it is, steaks at Ray's The Steaks are not just significantly less expensive than at big name steakhouses, but (and here's something that gets missed) also less expensive than at Clyde's and J. Pauls; even Cubano's and Rhodeside Grill charge more for their steaks than I do.

[mojoman]

Hi,

New to the board and first timer at RTS last night. I read this most recent page in the thread and was most impressed to see the owner's generosity with regard to injured military.

We had a great dinner there last night. My fiance and I were planning to go to the Pho 75 but checked RTS and were lucky; we got the last two top at that time.

We weren't that hungry so we both just had the NY strip. The steaks were delicious, excellent char without the pool of butter like Ruth Chris. No room for dessert but I'm sure those have been discussed upthread.

Michael, FWIW, I'd been to RTC before and I prefer RTS. The food was better at RTS; the decor better at RTC.

[Joe Riley]

I made my second visit to RTS last night, and I'm happy to comment about it.

The first time, I ordered the Hangar steak, which I liked, but not as much as the Hangar steak at Les Halles, and everyone else was having gorgeous New York strips, and I wished that I'd ordered that instead.

This time, I ordered the NY Strip "Classic" with blue cheese on top, mushrooms and the most delectable sauce I've ever had with a steak. Simply a gorgeous piece of meat, charred beautifully, cooked medium rare.

I loved the foccacia bread, the creamed spinach and mashed potatoes and I had a tasty glass of Mark West Pinot Noir with it, which acquitted itself quite nicely. My onion soup appetizer was possibly the best restaurant onion soup I've ever had, certainly I've not had better. The cheese wasn't baked-on and voluminous, which I usually don't mind, but this one really put the emphasis on the soup itself.

I was pleasantly surprised to get a little cup of cinnamon-spiced hot chocolate afterwards. Delicious!

When I had my take-out box (yeah, I couldn't finish it all, but it's probably my fault for loading up on chips, guacamole and salsa and beer at Guajilo next door while waiting for my table) I even thin that they "topped-off" my spinach and potatoes (!!!) Who does that? Great touch, and much appreciated.

Not a place to go to if you're in a hurry to eat, unless you get there right at 5:30 when they open, but well-worth the wait.

[Pat]

I even thin that they "topped-off" my spinach and potatoes (!!!) Who does that? Great touch, and much appreciated.

Yup, you usually come home with more in the take-out box than you left on the table .

[porcupine]

Dear Michael,

Your house desserts are all very good and at this point, just like the creamed spinach and mashed potatoes, part of what makes Ray's: The Steaks so loveable. A signature touch, so to speak. So there really is no need to, shall we say, supplement them. Really. However, if you need some testers outside regular business hours, I'm happy to volunteer. Just give me a moment to put my snark away.

[Spiral Stairs]

My dad's coming to town in a couple weeks and I'll be happily indulging his special request that we dine at RTS. In the past, we've employed the Don Rockwell Blue Hair Dinner Strategy and eaten really early in order to avoid the crowds. However, thanks to a confluence of circumstances, it looks like we'll be a party of four entering the belly of the beast at 8PM on a Saturday.

Any experience with throwing caution to the wind like this? I'm scared. Will we be sloshed on two hours worth of Guajillo margaritas and stuffed with chips and salsa by the time we're seated? (The babysitter has a vested interest in knowing the answer to this question.)

[jpschust]

My dad's coming to town in a couple weeks and I'll be happily indulging his special request that we dine at RTS. In the past, we've employed the Don Rockwell Blue Hair Dinner Strategy and eaten really early in order to avoid the crowds. However, thanks to a confluence of circumstances, it looks like we'll be a party of four entering the belly of the beast at 8PM on a Saturday.

Any experience with throwing caution to the wind like this? I'm scared. Will we be sloshed on two hours worth of Guajillo margaritas and stuffed with chips and salsa by the time we're seated? (The babysitter has a vested interest in knowing the answer to this question.)

Can you get there earlier in the day to try and put your name on the list?

[Scott Johnston]

ML and all:

Any word on the build out of the new RTS or Ray's Burger barn?

[Spiral Stairs]

Can you get there earlier in the day to try and put your name on the list?

I forgot about "the list," which I don't fully understand and which therefore frightens and confuses me. I may be able to do that -- it may depend on what plans develop for the rest of the day. I guess I'm sort of curious about the worst-case scenario here. (I.e., not on list, thrown to the wolves, fisticuffs for prime waiting space.)

[Waitman]

I forgot about "the list," which I don't fully understand and which therefore frightens and confuses me. I may be able to do that -- it may depend on what plans develop for the rest of the day. I guess I'm sort of curious about the worst-case scenario here. (I.e., not on list, thrown to the wolves, fisticuffs for prime waiting space.)

I haven't been to Ray's in a while but am looking forward to hitting it once the Lent thing is over for Friday dinner after the Symphony, meaning I'll hit the place about 10PM, when lines are short or gone.

Which got me to thinking, if you get there at 8, and you're looking at an hour-and-a-half wait, why not just go at 9:30 and wait only half an hour? Take a nap, see movie, jog, whatever. (I've always it a shame that they took the topless joint out of that strip mall, but since that may be the location that became Ray's, I guess it's a fair trade).

But why fling yourself into the sanguinary street-brawl that is prime time?

[Spiral Stairs]

... Which got me to thinking, if you get there at 8, and you're looking at an hour-and-a-half wait, why not just go at 9:30 and wait only half an hour? Take a nap, see movie, jog, whatever. ...

Is that what it is likely to be? An hour-and-a-half? In my particular case, we may run into babysitting issues if we push it too late. (Also, we are talking about time with family here. I.e., perhaps I'd like to spend that hour-and-a-half fortifying myself with margaritas.)

[DanielK]

Is that what it is likely to be? An hour-and-a-half? In my particular case, we may run into babysitting issues if we push it too late. (Also, we are talking about time with family here. I.e., perhaps I'd like to spend that hour-and-a-half fortifying myself with margaritas.)

Stop by any time that afternoon, after about 2pm. Give your name, size of party, and desired time, and that's pretty equivalent to a reservation.

If you don't, I'd guess a 90 minute wait is probably about right.

Any chance of making it a visit to RTC in Silver Spring instead, so you can make the reservation now?

[Spiral Stairs]

Stop by any time that afternoon, after about 2pm. Give your name, size of party, and desired time, and that's pretty equivalent to a reservation.

If you don't, I'd guess a 90 minute wait is probably about right.

Any chance of making it a visit to RTC in Silver Spring instead, so you can make the reservation now?

Thanks. (And RTC is not an option because my dad has a special thing for RTS.)

[nashman1975]

Sorry to take this off topic (Don please delete or move if you so desire). I can't find it, but can I buy raw steaks to cook at home from RTS. Michael--if you are looking (your mailbox is full).

Thanks

Nashman

[Ferhat Yalcin]

you can buy raw steaks to cook (try to go before the service starts), I do it all the time and they are awesome.

[jiveturk21]

I think that we should just retire this thread, is there really anything more to say about this place!?

It's just simply awesome. My only complaint about it in the past has been that it is tough to get a seat on many nights, but not when you have your off-from-work-early friend go there early and put you on the list! Without that complaint, I guess the only bad thing that I can say about it is that my butt stuck to the seats a bit while sitting in the booth.

Perfect service, wonderful wine list, great food for a superb value, all in a comfortable setting. As far as I am concerned, I really don't need anything else.

Listen, I have been to Ray's four or five times now (which is A LOT for me), and I have hit some bumps along the road, but when this place is humming along, it is just about everything that I want in a restaurant. Kudos to everyone working there last night, it was flawless.

[RWBooneJr]

New locations? http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/doc/fbh/624176301.html

[Scott Johnston]

Ray's the booger and the new RTS when they move. Of course knowing ML he has probably changed his plans

New locations? http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/doc/fbh/624176301.html

[bettyjoan]

Finally, FINALLY, I got to experience the magical wonderment that is Ray's the Steaks! It's rare (pun intended) that a restaurant can live up to the level of hype that surrounds this place, but in my book, RTS absolutely does. I would like to go back, oh, now-ish.

We arrived and were seated right at 5 PM when they opened--having been prepared for the minimalist decor, I wasn't as jarred by it as some first-timers have been. My group of 4 opted for a lovely and reasonably priced bottle of shiraz, and we decided to go with soups for appetizers--two crab bisques and two onion soups. The former was delicious--creamy and sweet, but also with some nice acidity, and LOADED with crabmeat. The latter was good, though a little less cheesy than I would prefer--BUT, the pieces of beefy goodness in the broth more than made up for that!

Two of my gal pals ordered filets, and they had great char to them. I ordered the cajun ribeye, which was cooked PERFECTLY (rare) and had amazing flavor. It was covered in sauteed garlic, which I was hesitant about at first, but it was so mellow and tender that it was a great compliment to the spice. The favorite cut of the night was the hanger steak--amazing! Now I understand why people talk about it like they do. The creamed spinach was one of the better versions I've had, and the mashed potatoes were also yummy.

For dessert, we had milk chocolate mousse (droooooool) and key lime pie. Now, I make a pretty mean key lime pie myself. But the crust on the RTS version? Unbelievable.

With all of that food, two bottles of wine, and tip, it worked out to about $60 per person. SOOOOO incredibly reasonable, especially when you consider that we all departed with leftovers (which I, in a drunken haze, left under my chair at the bar we visited after dinner--for shame, I know, but at least a friend recovered the container and enjoyed the spoils the next day). Can't wait for my next visit!

[Apples & Bananas]

There's a sign up at a vacant storefront near Courthouse where RTS will be moving/expanding. Now if they can only expand and take over the Cheesecake Factory space I'd be happy.

New locations? http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/doc/fbh/624176301.html

[Escoffier]

It was covered in sauteed garlic, which I was hesitant about at first, but it was so mellow and tender that it was a great compliment to the spice.

so you had a full complement of compliments and no complaints about the garlic being nice to the spice?

[hillvalley]

Yes, Ray's can easily be considered one of the "sacred cows" on this board, but there is a good reason why. They just serve one of the best meals in the city.

MelGold and I spent the evening in one of our favorite ways: "deflowering another friend at Ray's" as she put it. Part of the joy in evening was watching our friend take his first bite of his hanger, the look on his face when the garlic mashed potatoes were placed on the table, the giggle that popped out during the meal.

It's just a damn good steak. And the Sunday night deal allows a splurge at an affordable price.

[collije]

Spent tonight there with the pleasure of bringing my better half for the 1st time there [she's not a huge carnivore but it was my B-Day today & she obliged me lol]. Had the entrecôte using the House Special style, my personal fav. She had the hanger, crab bisque, and the shared the dark chocolate mousse [Michael, please bring that back to the Classics!], and loved her meal.

The Sunday night "Place at the Table" deal is a delicious value, and lets me have enough for 2nd meal the next day. Add that partf the proceeds of each meal for the Sunday deal is donated to a charitable organization ... is just another reason to visit

Oh, & hi Hillvalley, hope things have been great with you!

[StephenB]

Yes, Ray's can easily be considered one of the "sacred cows" on this board.

For the sake of rockwellian integrity, I will try to be negative. One of my sons and I arrived at 6 tonight and there was already a line (but they took us right in). We sat near the kitchen (which I happen to think is a good spot from which to view the room). It was noisy (but what can my son say that I haven't heard before?). The oppressing blank walls need a visit from a muralist. We started with off-the-menu clam chowder (for him) and soupe à l'oignon (for me). I had the diablo sirloin and Lucas had the hangar. The doneness was as we requested, but I'm used to that by now. The portions were generous but not overly so, the take-home will yield a couple of sandwiches, no more. They brought the regular potatoes the first time around and we had to ask for the garlic version. It was distressing to see how quickly all that beautiful food disappeared. My favorite waitperson (Simone) was off having a baby, but the other service people were good, too. The "Place at the Table" gimmick has grown stale -- I no longer get a rush out of knowing that satisfying my gluttony is an eleemosynary act. The always-amusing Michael Landrum was nowhere to be seen. That's it. Everything else was good to good-plus. Drat.

[Michael Landrum]

... "deflowering another friend at Ray's"...

Hmmm...I think I know what we will be offering as a Membership Reward for DonRockwell.com Cardholders.

Harderer than a rock and taking "hands-on" to a whole other level...

[Ilaine]

Finally made it to Ray's. My husband hates to wait and we almost never go to Rosslyn anyway but last night we picked up a frozen piglet from El Chaparral Meat Market, and it was perfect weather for sitting on the patio with a glass of wine, so it worked out.

Good thing, too, as I had the best steak I ever had in my life! Wonderful meat, perfectly cooked, seared into deliciousness. Wow. (Ribeye with horseradish cream on the side. The other people in the group [bleu cheese, diablo, au poivre] wished they had plain meat or their sauces on the side, as well. The meat really doesn't need sauce at all.)

The crab bisque full of big white lumps of crab meat, redolent of browned butter, the Caesar salad sweet cool and crisp with lashings of parm, creamed spinach that tasted like spinach raised to a higher power, but the boys wolfed down the mashed potatoes, which certainly looked good, pout.

Wow.

[Michael Landrum]

Finally made it to Ray's. My husband hates to wait and we almost never go to Rosslyn anyway but last night we picked up a frozen piglet from El Chaparral Meat Market, and it was perfect weather for sitting on the patio with a glass of wine, so it worked out.

Good thing, too, as I had the best steak I ever had in my life! Wonderful meat, perfectly cooked, seared into deliciousness. Wow. (Ribeye with horseradish cream on the side. The other people in the group [bleu cheese, diablo, au poivre] wished they had plain meat or their sauces on the side, as well. The meat really doesn't need sauce at all.)

The crab bisque full of big white lumps of crab meat, redolent of browned butter, the Caesar salad sweet cool and crisp with lashings of parm, creamed spinach that tasted like spinach raised to a higher power, but the boys wolfed down the mashed potatoes, which certainly looked good, pout.

Wow.

Glad you enjoyed yourself and thanks for the high praise. But why, oh why, did you go without? The sides are not only free, but bottomless. All you have to do is ask. Same goes for the garlic potatoes--we automatically serve them to parties of four or larger, but if your party is smaller, just ask and we'll bring them in addition to the regular spuds.

As in all things I take my inspiration from Biggie Smalls--"Believe me sweety/I got enough to feed the needy."

Same is true at Ray's: The Classics (which does take reservations, so no wait).

[jpschust]

Glad you enjoyed yourself and thanks for the high praise. But why, oh why, did you go without? The sides are not only free, but bottomless. All you have to do is ask. Same goes for the garlic potatoes--we automatically serve them to parties of four or larger, but if your party is smaller, just ask and we'll bring them in addition to the regular spuds.

As in all things I take my inspiration from Biggie Smalls--"Believe me sweety/I got enough to feed the needy."

Same is true at Ray's: The Classics (which does take reservations, so no wait).

Dude, you officially win the award for the coolest restauranteur ever.

[CrescentFresh]

I never thought it possible to eat at Ray's and NOT run into someone I know, usually from this particular community. Then, lo and behold, during our entire dinner tonight -- no one. Almost. We made it to having our plates cleared when Mel Gold spotted us and came to say hi. And you know, for the most part, I guess it's a good thing to go to Ray's and always know you'll see friends.

I never thought it possible to eat at Ray's and NOT have a box of leftover food to take home. Holy cow! It happened tonight! I need to go back to my cowboy cuts.

Some pretty good steaks at this place. You should check it out.

[MelGold]

We made it to having our plates cleared when Mel Gold spotted us and came to say hi.

My friends & I had to settle on a table at Guajillo instead of an amazing steak since one member of our party had late plans to meet up with friends and I couldn't manage to swing by early enough to put our names down on the list. Seeing MissyMel and CF through the front window was better than dessert though - just wish I wasn't blocking the aisle so I could have stayed & chatted a bit longer (and gotten a spoonful of milk chocolate mousse before hitting the road ).

[kat6185]

Call me a newbie (OK, I am but still..) - I had no idea that you could ask for the garlic mashed potatoes! I've only been in parties of 2 but I'll certainly be making the request next time regardless of party size. Thanks Michael! (BTW - was that you in the plaid shorts and Hawaiian shirt on Wednesday?)

[vsky]

my $29 NY would cost $38-$42, and my $33 Cowboy would cost $45. As it is, steaks at Ray's The Steaks are not just significantly less expensive than at big name steakhouses, but (and here's something that gets missed) also less expensive than...J. Paul’s;

I don't see how you can state definitively that your steaks (as listed) are less expensive than J.Pauls, considering they do not have a 16oz NY or a 28oz cowboy. However J-Paul’s 12oz NY strip is 25.95. $1 more than your 12oz (if an online menu is too be believed) – 2 sides for both. I may sound snarky but as GF (good/girl, you pick) of a kitchen fellow there, it irks me to see the "significantly less expensive" implication that is in the tone of the post, for a largely unknown quantity. I really enjoyed your restaurant and the low cost the time I was there (even posted it here!) but the post sounds like you own the market for restaurant folks who care about the diner's experience food-wise and fiscally. I'm probably overreacting, but the implication was that those restaurants you listed don’t care, at least fiscally. I could care less what the rest of the places listed charge, but would be curious to see if you even checked on-line menus before making your assertions! FYI –to try for a true comparison, I asked what the cost 16oz NY strip might run in the G-town J-Pauls... "it depends, but around $28-30..."...not far from $29 (...do hope to try RTC or RTS again...)

[Michael Landrum]

I don't see how you can state definitively that your steaks (as listed) are less expensive than J.Pauls, considering they do not have a 16oz NY or a 28oz cowboy. However J-Paul’s 12oz NY strip is 25.95. $1 more than your 12oz (if an online menu is too be believed) – 2 sides for both. I may sound snarky but as GF (good/girl, you pick) of a kitchen fellow there, it irks me to see the "significantly less expensive" implication that is in the tone of the post, for a largely unknown quantity. I really enjoyed your restaurant and the low cost the time I was there (even posted it here!) but the post sounds like you own the market for restaurant folks who care about the diner's experience food-wise and fiscally. I'm probably overreacting, but the implication was that those restaurants you listed don’t care, at least fiscally. I could care less what the rest of the places listed charge, but would be curious to see if you even checked on-line menus before making your assertions! FYI –to try for a true comparison, I asked what the cost 16oz NY strip might run in the G-town J-Pauls... "it depends, but around $28-30..."...not far from $29 (...do hope to try RTC or RTS again...)

You raise a valid point, and I welcome having any of my statements questioned or challenged--the more so the more outrageous, contentious or controversial they be. You also bring up the point, unintentionally perhaps, just how much misinformation and deception is involved when it comes to beef (and all restaurant ingredients, to be honest) and what a restaurant is charging for.

Firstly, the claim was that my steaks are significantly less expensive than the big name steakhouses that lay claim to serving premium, world-class, exclusively available steaks. I don't think there is much argument there.

Secondly, and my apologies if this requires too close a reading to be clear, I only stated that even compared to steaks at non-steakhouse restaurants, mine are still less expensive (I did not say significantly) for the same size steak, regardless of quality.

I mentioned these other restaurants (which do not lay claim to premium quality steaks, and are not considered steakhouses) to highlight the true value of my premium product (which some times gets missed because the steaks are, relatively speaking, expensive in absolute terms) and to underscore the very fact that you point out--that the steakhouse cuts are not available at restaurants other than steakhouses (both because the larger the cut, the more obvious the quality of the beef, or lack thereof, and because of the expertise and care necessary to grill the over-sized steaks which is not possible at a broad-menu restaurant). Further, unlike other steakhouses who do not offer a 12 ounce cut so as to maintain inflated check averages, we do make one available to keep us compatible with a wider range of dining preferences.

Not to comment on the overall quality of the restaurant or its employees (two of my grill cooks have come from there), J. Paul's uses either a USDA Select commercial quality beef, or one of the distributor-label brands which are given names that impy above-Select quality, but which are really bottom-third-of-Select quality (such as "Chef's Choice" or "Silver Label" or "Butcher's Premium") and the steaks arrive pre-cut and cryovac-ed (which is true at most steakhouse as well, by the way). In any case, the comparison I made is true, regardless of quality, if you allow that I did not claim that my steaks were significantly less expensive then theirs, merely less expensive.

As to what they would charge for a 16 ounce cut, it is simply not possible or feasible for them to offer one (again, I say this without disparagement, and if your friend can pull it off, considering the operational constraints on dupe times of their system and the increased likelihood of of re-cooks and send-backs, he is quite remarkably talented and I would love to hire him) so the price comparison is only theoretical.

For the record, I did not check menu prices on-line, but rather in the restaurant itself in all of the cases mentioned.

I hope I do not come across as smug in any way (always a big risk with me) in answering your questions, that I have successfully removed unnecessary irks from your life, and that I cleared up any misunderstandings in my original statements.

[vsky]

You raise a valid point, and I welcome having any of my statements questioned or challenged--the more so the more outrageous, contentious or controversial they be. You also bring up the point, unintentionally perhaps, just how much misinformation and deception is involved when it comes to beef (and all restaurant ingredients, to be honest) and what a restaurant is charging for. Firstly, the claim was that my steaks are significantly less expensive than the big name steakhouses that lay claim to serving premium, world-class, exclusively available steaks. I don't think there is much argument there. Secondly, and my apologies if this requires too close a reading to be clear, I only stated that even compared to steaks at non-steakhouse restaurants, mine are still less expensive (I did not say significantly) for the same size steak, regardless of quality. I mentioned these other restaurants (which do not lay claim to premium quality steaks, and are not considered steakhouses) to highlight the true value of my premium product (which some times gets missed because the steaks are, relatively speaking, expensive in absolute terms) and to underscore the very fact that you point out--that the steakhouse cuts are not available at restaurants other than steakhouses (both because the larger the cut, the more obvious the quality of the beef, or lack thereof, and because of the expertise and care necessary to grill the over-sized steaks which is not possible at a broad-menu restaurant). Further, unlike other steakhouses who do not offer a 12 ounce cut so as to maintain inflated check averages, we do make one available to keep us compatible with a wider range of dining preferences. Not to comment on the overall quality of the restaurant or its employees (two of my grill cooks have come from there), J.Paul's uses either a USDA Select commercial quality beef, or one of the distributor-label brands which are given names that impy above-Select quality, but which are really bottom-third-of-Select quality (such as "Chef's Choice" or "Silver Label" or "Butcher's Premium") and the steaks arrive pre-cut and cryovac-ed (which is true at most steakhouse as well, by the way). In any case, the comparison I made is true, regardless of quality, if you allow that I did not claim that my steaks were significantly less expensive then theirs, merely less expensive. As to what they would charge for a 16 ounce cut, it is simply not possible or feasible for them to offer one (again, I say this without disparagement, and if your friend can pull it off, considering the operational constraints on dupe times of their system and the increased likelihood of of re-cooks and send-backs, he is quite remarkably talented and I would love to hire him) so the price comparison is only theoretical. For the record, I did not check menu prices on-line, but rather in the restaurant itself in all of the cases mentioned. I hope I do not come across as smug in any way (always a big risk with me) in answering your questions, that I have successfully removed unnecessary irks from your life, and that I cleared up any misunderstandings in my original statements.

For some reason you chose to use J.Paul’s and the one steak you mentioned in common to support your premise of lower-priced steaks, which was true by $1. You are factually accurate there. That being said there are lines being crossed by your second statement, that I think have no place on this board, but that's not my call to make.

Information regarding the USDA quality of beef for J.Paul’s is flat out wrong. It's USDA Choice, period. You may want to be careful to consider where you get your information.

The assertion that this restaurant cannot produce a 16oz NY strip, not your call to make, and again, flat out wrong.

The steaks (with the exception of the bone-in filet) do not come precut and cryovac-ed; again false information.

It's your choice as a restaurant owner to validate your own quality of food by devaluing others. However if in a public forum, to incorrectly devalue the food quality of another in your industry...it's in poor taste, and that seems to ultimately takes away from the value of your restaurant.

The bottom-line is that you misrepresented another restaurant, and ultimately those in who work in the kitchen - multiple times, and it makes me wonder why you cannot extol upon your own virtues without having to falsely represent others, I would think that it's diminishing to your own establishment to say the least.

If you wonder why I'm even discussing this as I don't work there, it's because when a restaurant where someone you care for works, and their work is misrepresented in a forum that you participate it, it just doesn't seem okay...even if they aren't a “sacred cow”, they might be sacred to you.

Anya

[mame11]

For some reason you chose to use J.Paul’s and the one steak you mentioned in common to support your premise of lower-priced steaks, which was true by $1. You are factually accurate there. That being said there are lines being crossed by your second statement, that I think have no place on this board, but that's not my call to make.

Information regarding the USDA quality of beef for J.Paul’s is flat out wrong. It's USDA Choice, period. You may want to be careful to consider where you get your information.

The assertion that this restaurant cannot produce a 16oz NY strip, not your call to make, and again, flat out wrong.

The steaks (with the exception of the bone-in filet) do not come precut and cryovac-ed; again false information.

It's your choice as a restaurant owner to validate your own quality of food by devaluing others. However if in a public forum, to incorrectly devalue the food quality of another in your industry...it's in poor taste, and that seems to ultimately takes away from the value of your restaurant.

The bottom-line is that you misrepresented another restaurant, and ultimately those in who work in the kitchen - multiple times, and it makes me wonder why you cannot extol upon your own virtues without having to falsely represent others, I would think that it's diminishing to your own establishment to say the least.

If you wonder why I'm even discussing this as I don't work there, it's because when a restaurant where someone you care for works, and their work is misrepresented in a forum that you participate it, it just doesn't seem okay...even if they aren't a “sacred cow”, they might be sacred to you.

Anya

I do not think anything Michael has said is in poor taste. There is absolutely nothing wrong with him comparing his product to that of his competitors. There is nothing wrong with him saying that his restaurant's approach to pricing and quality is different than others. In fact, both are tried and true methods of marketing and branding.

[vsky]

I do not think anything Michael has said is in poor taste. There is absolutely nothing wrong with him comparing his product to that of his competitors. There is nothing wrong with him saying that his restaurant's approach to pricing and quality is different than others. In fact, both are tried and true methods of marketing and branding.

If his statements are false are they not in poor taste? Hence the word "incorrectly" regarding "poor taste." That is what is at issue.

[hm212]

I have been to RTC (and RTS) dozens of times and had a GREAT meal at a very fair price every single time. The service is right on too.

Discussions are fine but don't rip up one of the best restaurants (and values think bar deal) in Montgomery County for an English lessons.

Bottom Line - When I want steak this is the place (Actually RTC because they take reservations and I live in Montgomery county). No one else even comes close.

If his statements are false are they not in poor taste? Hence the word "incorrectly" regarding "poor taste." That is what is at issue.

[Spiral Stairs]

I've got no horse in this dog-and-pony show (or whatever). I don't know who uses precut steaks, or Cry-o-Vac'ed steak, or pre-chewed Soylent Green. But if Michael doesn't have the facts right as to the restaurant to which he's chosen to compare his, then that's not an English lesson. That's an important mistake that should be corrected. Imagine if someone posted something here about Ray's using Cry-o-vac'ed, precut steaks, or using Select meat. The server would crash under the weight of the collective response.

I'm a big, big fan of the Ray's places. But the fact that they are excellent restaurants serving excellent food at excellent prices doesn't give the owner carte blanche to get the facts wrong as to the competitors. (If that is what happened. Again, I disavow any knowledge of anything.)

[jparrott]

Mmm....pass the spiced cashews....